Quote Originally Posted by JellyPooga View Post
You cannot weigh in on a Rogue (DPR) argument without knowing this. .
I am of course aware that rogue benefits uniquely from off turn attacks - I had just never considered the particular interaction between rogues and haste.

Their off turn attacks conflict directly with them defending themselves of course. As does Steady Aim with anything else they want to do. I will grant - and have granted, since the beginning of this thread - that rogue is perfectly functional. Truenamer or 3e Samurai they are not. But you playing Schrodinger's Rogue and giving them credit for EVERYTHING they can do, all at once, does not convince me they are better than last place among 5e classes. That indeed is a huge problem for them: they can do some stuff. But not at the frequency they need to. If they dash, they can't disengage. If they disengage, they can't hide. If they give themselves advantage (a large factor in their DPR), they can't do ANY of those things cause they can't move. If they're tough, they also lose a ton of DPR. Unfortunately for rogue, there's class options that are not so burdened by the action economy.