# Forum > Comics > Webcomics >  Girl Genius XXXI: Lets look at it from farther away!

## Manga Shoggoth

It is a world ruled by *Mad Science*! Things *happen*. Usually, they happen to *other* people. *This* is *entertainment*. *That's* when the front door gets blown in- And you belatedly realize that, once again, *you* are doomed to be the entertainment in another exciting installment of: *GIRL GENIUS*!

Many elegant, finely-crafted, and vintage links follow:

*Links to Previous Threads*
*Spoiler*
Show

Girl Genius! (thread)
Girl Genius II
Girl Genius III: Nize Thread!
Girl Genius IV: Because SCIENCE! is my mistress
Girl Genius V: Madre de Diodes!
Girl Genius VI: Der Pestle in Der Kestle
Girl Genius VII: Get on the Slab, I Want to Get to Work!
Girl Genius: VIII Will Show Them All!
Girl Genius IX: The Unstoppable Thread
Girl Genius X: The Othar Shoe Drops
Girl Genius XI: Ding Dong, the Baron's Dead!
Girl Genius XII: For Doom The Bell Tolls
Girl Genius XIII: "Gott's Leedle Feesh in Trousers!"
Girl Genius XIV: A Lightning Arc in All But Speed!
Girl Genius XV: The Weasel, the Spark, and the Wardrobe
Girl Genius XVI: The Wrath of Klaus
Girl Genius XVII: And Then He Had Pie
Girl Genius XVIII: Invisible Hand of the Legendary Smoke Knights
Girl Genius XIX: Worth a Third of Your Grade
Girl Genius XX: Endothermic Life Forms Are Inherently Heretical
Girl Genius XXI: Cancel the Jugglers
Girl Genius XXII: Paris Needs Pants
Girl Genius XXIII: Screaming, Ranting and Egregious Violence
Girl Genius XXIV: Ask Vit a Bit More Terror
Girl Genius XXV: It needs work! BUT THE CONCEPT IS SOUND!
Girl Genius XXVI: Madness is the best possible response
Girl Genius XXVII: Hoy! Hennybody else not dead?
Girl Genius XXVIII: Dancink! Ve is here for de dancink!
Girl Genius XXIX: A giant corkboard of continuity madness
Girl Genius: XXXenophile Edition
Girl Genius XXXI: Lets look at it from farther away!



*Comic Links*
Link to current comic and link to the beginning of the strip. (Updates MWF, usually after Midnight [Eastern Time])
The Continuing Adventures of Othar Tryggvassen, _Gentleman Adventurer!_ (back on hiatus, may update in the future)
A compilation (and much easier to read if you're just catching up) of the first three chapters can be found   here at the GG website.
And if one goes to snapbird.org and types in "Othar" in the 'Who?' field, all of Othar's adventures can be read on one page (albiet in reverse order of posting - Now must have a Twitter account to use).
Mirror of the comic found on LiveJournal (No longer being updated as of Mid-May, 2017)
Mirror of the comic found on Facebook (Will occasionally have Girl Genius related news)
And one can find mirrors of _Girl Genius_ on deviantArt as well. (Occasionally Kaja will put up or link to interesting GG related art that is found on dA)

*Reference Links*
Wiki Project devoted to to _Girl Genius_
Wikipedia entry on _Girl Genius_.
TV Tropes page on _Girl Genius_.
The Secret Blueprints (NOTE: Contains background information on the GG Universe, so it should probably be read *after* "catching up" to the newest comic, as it contains many spoilers.)

*Social Media and News Links*
(The Goglios also provide some links at the bottom of the comic pages)
Phil Foglio's new Wordpress art, news,  and blogging website.
Kaja Foglio's LJ Page and Studio Foglio News LJ Page (Not currently being updated)
Kaja & Phil's Personal Facebook Page (Not currently being updated)
A twitter account that basically is a catch-all feed for _Girl Genius_ related news.
Cheyenne Wright's Twitter and LiveJournal Accounts (The colorist's twitter and LJ pages)

And finally,
Phil's old LJ page. (Occasionally contains crossposts from the Wordpress website)

====

*Q: What is this "Sneaky Gate" y'alls go on about?*

Sneaky gate: Named from this hidden gate in comic, it has become a name for viewing new comics early. Remember, if you're going to discuss the new comic, put it in spoiler boxes until the release time (12am EST).

Sneaky Gate 101:
Right click the comic image.Select view image or copy paste the image location into the address bar.Modify the date to be the day you're trying to look at. (ex. 20120111 -> 20120113)Go to the modified url.Be disappointed when there's no early comic to read.Alternately, enjoy the comic!

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## Shining Wrath

Continuing discussions:
I have my doubts about Othar's sanity.I still expect Bang & sire to appear with an airship and evacuate Team Agatha.I was betting on Clankrezia to win the Princess battle, but now it appears that's impossible, and she's playing spoiler to Monahan.Where are Castle and Train?

And a sorta-new topic: did Agatha "solve" the problem of the corrupted waters when she redirected all the corruption onto the battling Princesses?
And a topic I don't think we've mooted sufficiently: who corrupted the waters in the first place? Are they still around?

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## InvisibleBison

> And a topic I don't think we've mooted sufficiently: who corrupted the waters in the first place? Are they still around?


Has it been demonstrated that the corruption of the waters was the result of someone's action, as opposed to some sort of natural process?

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## geoduck

> Has it been demonstrated that the corruption of the waters was the result of someone's action, as opposed to some sort of natural process?


Agatha says at one point that she believes Monahan's experiments have been causing the corruption.

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## wingnutx

Sucks to be those guys.

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## Shining Wrath

> Has it been demonstrated that the corruption of the waters was the result of someone's action, as opposed to some sort of natural process?





> Agatha says at one point that she believes Monahan's experiments have been causing the corruption.


My recollection is that Clankrezia didn't know who had caused the corruption, but said that it wasn't her. Monahan's ascension to Queenhood was delayed by the corruption, and once Clankrezia showed her how to remove it, that's when the Ascension Wars began. That makes me think it's unlikely that Monahan put the corruption in intentionally.

I'm thinking it's a Vapnoodle thing, but time will tell.

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## Divayth Fyr

> My recollection is that Clankrezia didn't know who had caused the corruption, but said that it wasn't her. Monahan's ascension to Queenhood was delayed by the corruption, and once Clankrezia showed her how to remove it, that's when the Ascension Wars began. That makes me think it's unlikely that Monahan put the corruption in intentionally.


But what about Monahan causing the corruption _unintentionally_?

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## tyckspoon

> But what about Monahan causing the corruption _unintentionally_?


This is what I took from it - Monahan thought the effluvia was missing something, and was trying to process it by adding supplements or otherwise 'enhancing' it. While some of those attempts probably did nothing notable, I'm sure at least some of it made the corruption worse. Lucrezia showed her she was starting from bad assumptions - it was _already tainted_ and needed to have the existing contaminants removed. 

Although I doubt Monahan's experiments were fully responsible for the corruption; assuming the runoff from this spring/Flame is similar in nature to the Dyne even the 'pure' stuff would have interesting effects on the surrounding waters. The initial corruption is likely because the constructions that were supposed to contain/redirect/extract the energies from the runoff had broken down and allowed the spring to leak out into the surrounding waters.

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## Shining Wrath

> But what about Monahan causing the corruption _unintentionally_?





> This is what I took from it - Monahan thought the effluvia was missing something, and was trying to process it by adding supplements or otherwise 'enhancing' it. While some of those attempts probably did nothing notable, I'm sure at least some of it made the corruption worse. Lucrezia showed her she was starting from bad assumptions - it was _already tainted_ and needed to have the existing contaminants removed. 
> 
> Although I doubt Monahan's experiments were fully responsible for the corruption; assuming the runoff from this spring/Flame is similar in nature to the Dyne even the 'pure' stuff would have interesting effects on the surrounding waters. The initial corruption is likely because the constructions that were supposed to contain/redirect/extract the energies from the runoff had broken down and allowed the spring to leak out into the surrounding waters.


Castle and Train found corruption upstream from the point where Monahan could reach. Unless she was lying to Clankrezia, I think the corruption is ancient, and the erstwhile Queen of this island installed the purification devices.

Which, come to think of it, means it predates Vapnoodle, unless he too is a time traveler.

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## Wayson

> Castle and Train found corruption upstream from the point where Monahan could reach. Unless she was lying to Clankrezia, I think the corruption is ancient, and the erstwhile Queen of this island installed the purification devices.
> 
> Which, come to think of it, means it predates Vapnoodle, unless he too is a time traveler.


I mean, he could be?  He's (still?) off in another dimension (for the moment) and there are no indications of when or where he'll pop out.

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## Agi Hammerthief

> And Lucrezia must realize this. But she has plans to rule all of Europe. The slaver wasps will help, of course, but what level of power does Lucrezia think she's going to have to rule an area 5x or 10x that controlled by the legendarily powerful Albia?
> 
> Perhaps she intends to kill all other Sparks. In which case someone better keep an eye on Othar being a double-agent (or triple, as he'd likely kill Lucrezia given half a chance).


I think once she stand going after the queens the plan was to rule the world using every flame and the gates.

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## Mechalich

> I think once she stand going after the queens the plan was to rule the world using every flame and the gates.


One important thing is that Clankrezia, so far as we know, believes that Zola is actually Lucrezia, not an independent entity and that everything being done by the Queen of the Dawn is part of her plan (that she was unaware that Monahan could block her  is evidence of this gap). 

Clankrezia's lack of awareness on this subject seems to have influenced her failure to properly update her plans. She may even have been, in Paris, inadvertently working to further the goals of Zola's faction (assuming she was the one who sent the Geisters into Paris).

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## Shining Wrath

> One important thing is that Clankrezia, so far as we know, believes that Zola is actually Lucrezia, not an independent entity and that everything being done by the Queen of the Dawn is part of her plan (that she was unaware that Monahan could block her  is evidence of this gap). 
> 
> Clankrezia's lack of awareness on this subject seems to have influenced her failure to properly update her plans. She may even have been, in Paris, inadvertently working to further the goals of Zola's faction (assuming she was the one who sent the Geisters into Paris).


Grandma seemed to think that Zola had sent the Geisters - and Grandma is usually well-informed.

Bang has appeared sans papa. I expect papa to decide he cares about his daughter enough to bring the airship.

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## wingnutx

I'm lost. Who is Bang's papa?

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## sihnfahl

> I'm lost. Who is Bang's papa?


This guy.

He has a huge 'don't care' attitude...

But he IS how the others got on the island...

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## wingnutx

> This guy.
> 
> He has a huge 'don't care' attitude...
> 
> But he IS how the others got on the island...


I don't know how I missed that.

Thanks!

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## otakuryoga

engines in pieces?
hours to put back together but you need to leave RIGHT NOW?
good thing there are some sparkies around(*NOTE* i did NOT say safe..just good)

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## Agi Hammerthief

> engines in pieces?
> hours to put back together but you need to leave RIGHT NOW?
> good thing there are some sparkies around(*NOTE* i did NOT say safe..just good)


an opportunity to play with the lamp and find the accelerate setting.

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## Scarlet Knight

I predict:

*Spoiler*
Show

 "We need to fly now!" "Well, if we can gather a lot of those rats onto this giant wheel & attach it to the propeller..."

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## Shining Wrath

What would take one ordinary mechanic with a, shall we say, lackadaisical altitude a couple of hours will take panicked Sparks about 5 minutes.

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## sihnfahl

> What would take one ordinary mechanic with a, shall we say, lackadaisical altitude a couple of hours will take panicked Sparks about 5 minutes.


If you can keep them from making 'improvements'.

And you don't mind the lack of something called 'safety'.

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## Shining Wrath

> If you can keep them from making 'improvements'.
> 
> And you don't mind the lack of something called 'safety'.


Improvements are part of the Madness Place, deal with it.  :Small Big Grin: 

I didn't mention safety, this thing will get airborne and then veer off toward Africa.

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## Kantaki

Well, if we let the Sparks handle this the airship will definitely go up.
Most likely in flames, but let's not sweat the details,

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## sihnfahl

> Well, if we let the Sparks handle this the airship will definitely go up.
> Most likely in flames, but let's not sweat the details,


How else are they supposed to get up quickly?  That's what the rockets are for.  They just need to repurpose the heating element of a toaster, a few teapots, and the funky sludge the airmen use to keep the airbag supple.

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## Shining Wrath

> How else are they supposed to get up quickly?  That's what the rockets are for.  They just need to repurpose the heating element of a toaster, a few teapots, and the funky sludge the airmen use to keep the airbag supple.


I would not be surprised if they explode a large part of the island in search of a JATO-like effect.

I'm going to be somewhat disappointed if a lot of valuable artifacts get destroyed by the Princess Temper Tantrums.

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## Squire Doodad

> I would not be surprised if they explode a large part of the island in search of a JATO-like effect.
> 
> I'm going to be somewhat disappointed if a lot of valuable artifacts get destroyed by the Princess Temper Tantrums.


A: "Do you two know there's a temple filled with ancient artifacts forgotten for 20,000 years under the island you're destroying"
M: "THERE'S WHAT?"

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## Radar

> I would not be surprised if they explode a large part of the island in search of a JATO-like effect.
> 
> I'm going to be somewhat disappointed if a lot of valuable artifacts get destroyed by the Princess Temper Tantrums.


I just remembered that multi-cultural vault and all those priceless vases predating queens.  :Small Frown:

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## Kantaki

New comic

Can't disagree with Bang's logic here.
The risk of getting Agatha or Gil into the Madness Place is definitely lower than that of sitting on the exploding island hoping things'll work out.
Mind you, with other Sparks things might look different, but most of those I wouldn't trust anyway.

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## Radar

Now I see Bang and von Zinzer as the best duo to control (for the lack of a better word) sparks: Bang to motivate them and von Zinzer to reel them in and keep them focused.

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## Shining Wrath

Bangladesh Dupree: life coach for Sparks.

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## Manga Shoggoth

What was it Tarvek said? "I had no idea She was capable of such self-awareness"?

While the good ol' psycho version is welcome everywhere (for a given value of "welcome", of course), I rather like that the current arc is giving us more of a glimpse into our favourite pirate captian.

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## wingnutx

> Bangladesh Dupree: life coach for Sparks.


I like it.

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## Fyraltari

> A: "Do you two know there's a temple filled with ancient artifacts forgotten for 20,000 years under the island you're destroying"
> M: "THERE'S WHAT?"


L: THERE *WAS*!



> Bangladesh Dupree: life coach for Sparks.


And death coach for everyone else!

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## Shining Wrath

> L: THERE *WAS*!
> 
> And death coach for everyone else!


Rising to the defense of Lucrezia, who gets picked on a lot, she'd want to preserve the ancient artifacts.
For use in the Mirrors, but still, she'd want to preserve them.

Now I'm trying to remember if Bangladesh has ever killed a Spark in-comic. None comes to mind. She did stab Tweedle a lot back when Agatha was escaping from his castle, but he's tough, he lived through it.

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## Fyraltari

> Rising to the defense of Lucrezia, who gets picked on a lot, she'd want to preserve the ancient artifacts.





> Please. I'm a time-traveller. I point and laugh at archeologists.





> For use in the Mirrors, but still, she'd want to preserve them.


Meh, most of the mirrors are destroyed and she seems primarily concerned with Europa and Skifander for now.

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## geoduck

> Meh, most of the mirrors are destroyed and she seems primarily concerned with Europa and Skifander for now.


We don't know if all the Mirrors are destroyed or just inactive.

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## Fyraltari

> We don't know if all the Mirrors are destroyed or just inactive.


Potato, potato.

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## Shining Wrath

> Potato, potato.


If, by obtaining an artifact from e.g., Atlantis, she could now travel to Atlantis and loot Atlantic artifacts that are any of [valuable, powerful, prestigious, or just pretty], I would think Lucrezia would be all about the looting.

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## Fyraltari

If the Mirrors don't work, they don't work, though. An Atlantean artefact won't help much if the thing is deactivated on the other side.

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## Shining Wrath

> If the Mirrors don't work, they don't work, though. An Atlantean artefact won't help much if the thing is deactivated on the other side.


What we don't know is how many mirrors are in Skifanderian status (still functional but no one on their side knows how to use them), how many are still functional but there's no one left alive at all after Lucrezia visited or society simply collapsed, how many are functional but are buried in rubble like the one here on the island seems destined to be, and how many are disabled.

We don't know for certain that they can be harmed by anything short of Sparky tech.

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## wingnutx

> She did stab Tweedle a lot back when Agatha was escaping from his castle, but he's tough, he lived through it.


He was also armored, iirc.

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## otakuryoga

wow
it is SUPER early
but i think we have a frontrunner for next thread title
"Didn't expect all this fuss"

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## Shining Wrath

> wow
> it is SUPER early
> but i think we have a frontrunner for next thread title
> "Didn't expect all this fuss"


I came in here with this same thought.

Dr. Rakethorne is not taking normal-level Agatha chaos well.

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## St Fan

Oh my, I am starting to think that Captain "Don't Care" may not be the most sterling example of competency...

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## TheStranger

> Oh my, I am starting to think that Captain "Don't Care" may not be the most sterling example of competency...


Nah, he just didnt expect all this fuss. 

All kidding aside, taking advantage of some downtime to catch up on maintenance isnt necessarily a bad thing.

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## Ailurus

Sure, using the downtime to fix up stuff is good.  Using the downtime to start at least 3 separate maintenance projects (the engines, the door and the pest control) and leaving them all half done is not so good.  One thing at a time, rather than multiple things all at once and all unfinished.

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## Scarlet Knight

Yeah but when you're a "Professional Castaway" you likely want to leave something to keep you occupied tomorrow...and Saturday...and next Arbor Day...

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## Kantaki

To be fair, before Team Agatha showed up he was stuck with a bunch of murderous lunatics (Okay, there's still Bang, but eh, that's family for ya.) so getting stuff fixed fast might not have been top priority.

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## TheStranger

> Sure, using the downtime to fix up stuff is good.  Using the downtime to start at least 3 separate maintenance projects (the engines, the door and the pest control) and leaving them all half done is not so good.  One thing at a time, rather than multiple things all at once and all unfinished.


Thats true, unless theres some reason to run them concurrently. Even if that reason is just that the engine is too much heavy lifting to work straight through on, so he fiddled with the door when he got tired, or that he got halfway through the door mechanism and ran into a problem that he wanted to think about for a bit.  The pest control, I think hes actually saying he was going to get to that after he finished the other projects. 

Or more likely the Foglios just thought it would be funny to have him treat airship maintenance like I treat home improvement projects. I swear Im going to rebuild the fire pit in the backyard next weekend, really.

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## Radar

> Thats true, unless theres some reason to run them concurrently. Even if that reason is just that the engine is too much heavy lifting to work straight through on, so he fiddled with the door when he got tired, or that he got halfway through the door mechanism and ran into a problem that he wanted to think about for a bit.  The pest control, I think hes actually saying he was going to get to that after he finished the other projects. 
> 
> Or more likely the Foglios just thought it would be funny to have him treat airship maintenance like I treat home improvement projects. I swear Im going to rebuild the fire pit in the backyard next weekend, really.


If a man says he will do it, he will do it - you do not have to remind him every 6 months.  :Small Wink:

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## Thomas Cardew

Also other than the engines, which he had in pieces as the active project he was working on, the other problems didn't matter for his original mission: ferrying 2 probably homicidal passengers. Cargo doors don't matter if you're not hauling cargo. Half lift capacity doesn't matter if you're operating well below that. The problem is he's being asked to suddenly perform a mass evacuation.

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## Kantaki

> Also other than the engines, which he had in pieces as the active project he was working on, the other problems didn't matter for his original mission: ferrying 2 probably homicidal passengers. Cargo doors don't matter if you're not hauling cargo. Half lift capacity doesn't matter if you're operating well below that. The problem is he's being asked to suddenly perform a mass evacuation.


Not the cargo doors.
The _hangar_ doors. Meaning, even if the piece of junk could fly they wouldn't get it out.
Not a problem if you are just sitting around with some maniacs who won't (let you) leave anytime soon anyway, but kinda bothersome when everything's busy exploding.

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## sihnfahl

> Dr. Rakethorne is not taking normal-level Agatha chaos well.


And that's when he realizes he can't do what his Queen wants; Agatha's NORMAL is so outside what is NORMAL that even Albia would have fun keeping up.

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## theangelJean

> Sure, using the downtime to fix up stuff is good.  Using the downtime to start at least 3 separate maintenance projects (the engines, the door and the pest control) and leaving them all half done is not so good.  One thing at a time, rather than multiple things all at once and all unfinished.


I was wondering if he was a bit Sparky, what with the rebuild-from-scratch bit.

But I guess Sparks don't leave things half-done. 90% done and just haven't found the perfect workaround for that pesky side-effect, maybe...

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## Radar

> I was wondering if he was a bit Sparky, what with the rebuild-from-scratch bit.
> 
> But I guess Sparks don't leave things half-done. 90% done and just haven't found the perfect workaround for that pesky side-effect, maybe...


Most importantly he does not have a single grain of excitement in him unlike any Spark we know.

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## Shining Wrath

> Most importantly he does not have a single grain of excitement in him unlike any Spark we know.


Furthermore, he's not trying to turn the balloon bees into guard insects, nor trying to make the hanger door capable of crushing disobedient minions, nor increasing the engine power 10-fold. Clearly NOT a Spark.

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## Scarlet Knight

Do I detect doubt in Bang? Can't say that's in character...

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## Shining Wrath

I'm going to guess that pirate queens are pretty good combat pilots.

At least one bot has made it safely to Agatha's shoulder.

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## sihnfahl

> Do I detect doubt in Bang? Can't say that's in character...


No, I think she's just surprised that Agatha asked it in the first place.  After all: Pirate Queen who's been working for WULFENBACH all these years?  How many deployments against sparks?  And what's been going on the past few years?

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## Agi Hammerthief

> No, I think she's just surprised that Agatha asked it in the first place.  After all: Pirate Queen who's been working for WULFENBACH all these years?  How many deployments against sparks?  And what's been going on the past few years?


I read that with a is water wet? youll find out when you jump in. tone of voice.

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## Shining Wrath

In the Agatha-level chaos, no one has told Zeetha that Higgs is safe in Skifander.
I wonder how the Queens will respond to the airship leaving. Both of them would probably like to have a ride to elsewhere, although Monahan may like the idea of ruling her own little rat-infested island.

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## Grim Portent

I think the whole island is sinking, so if Monahan wants to make a little rat kingdom it's going to need to resemble Atlantis more than anything.  :Small Big Grin:

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## sihnfahl

> I think the whole island is sinking, so if Monahan wants to make a little rat kingdom it's going to need to resemble Atlantis more than anything.


So... Londinium V2?

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## Shining Wrath

> I think the whole island is sinking, so if Monahan wants to make a little rat kingdom it's going to need to resemble Atlantis more than anything.





> So... Londinium V2?


If she can give rats wings, she can give them gills.  :Small Big Grin:  Also, how far will it sink, and can she manage to preserve an atoll?

EDIT: although it's a quote from me rather than the strip, I shall set aside my usual modesty and propose "Agatha Level Chaos" as a possible future strip title.

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## sihnfahl

> If she can give rats wings, she can give them gills.  Also, how far will it sink, and can she manage to preserve an atoll?


As long as she can survive with her precious rats, I don't think she'd mind not having one atoll.

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## Manga Shoggoth

> As long as she can survive with her precious rats, I don't think she'd mind not having one atoll.


I think she'd prefer allot though...

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## Kantaki

New comic

Nice boom. Now to deal with the (literal) flying rats.
Also, any bets with Queen will make a return?
This is a bit too obviously "no one could've survived that".

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## Shining Wrath

Why are the Winged Rats not defending their Queen? The first iteration of giant rats attacked Clankrezia. Did, possibly, Monahan realize the island was doomed and put some of her power into saving the rats, regardless of combat utility?

Maybe the balloon bees can be released to fight the rats?

I think the "Boom" is blowing the door open, not the Queens fighting. In which case Clankrezia may intervene as she has plans for Agatha's body.

https://Zeno of Citium founded the stoic school of philosophy. This may not be a good sign.

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## Scarlet Knight

Good thing it wasn't named after Zeno of Elea...they'd never get home....

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## Radar

> Good thing it wasn't named after Zeno of Elea...they'd never get home....


Still better than having one of those experimental Ulysses engines.

edit: while on a little archive binge, I found this page. The detail I missed before is Higg's comment that Igneous Heterodyne also has reached that state - at least for a moment before he exploded.

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## Fyraltari

> Still better than having one of those experimental Ulysses engines.


Wait. 13 years for 25 kilometers? How old was Saana when she left home?

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## Kantaki

> Wait. 13 years for 25 kilometers? How old was Saana when she left home?


I don't think their travel was entirely linear, temporally (and spatially) speaking.
Ullysses engines sound like they make time and space do funky things, by gallifreyan standards that is.
Or maybe time didn't quite flow inside the vessel*.

*Not a timestop exactly, more a "between the tik and the tok" situation. Moving alongside the stream of time instead of inside it.
Okay, I'm definitely not a Spark, Otherwise I could phrase this in a way that actually makes sense.
To me. :Small Tongue:

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## Fyraltari

Okay, now I kinda wish this Clankrezia dies at this size and ends up at the mouth of a river with one hand raised.




> I don't think their travel was entirely linear, temporally (and spatially) speaking.
> Ullysses engines sound like they make time and space do funky things, by gallifreyan standards that is.
> Or maybe time didn't quite flow inside the vessel*.
> 
> *Not a timestop exactly, more a "between the tik and the tok" situation. Moving alongside the stream of time instead of inside it.
> Okay, I'm definitely not a Spark, Otherwise I could phrase this in a way that actually makes sense.
> To me.


Okay but if the 25 years were external and it was like a week for her, what is her age difference with Othar supposed to be, then?

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## Agi Hammerthief

now well find out that Dupree Senior installed a Death Ray, I hope.

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## Kantaki

> Okay, now I kinda wish this Clankrezia dies at this size and ends up at the mouth of a river with one hand raised.
> 
> 
> 
> Okay but if the 25 years were external and it was like a week for her, what is her age difference with Othar supposed to be, then?


Just because they took a twentyfive years detour doesn't mean it was twentyfive years later when they arrived.
Might've been a day earlier.
I mean, just cause you take a three miles long route to get somewhere 500m away doesn't mean your goal is somehow further away geographically. You just walked a very long curve. Same principle, just with time.

New comic
Sometimes removing the fog of war is a bad idea. :Small Eek:

----------


## Ailurus

Sigh.  I'm really ready for Lucrezia to just be removed from the story entirely.  Sure, she is the main antagonist but seriously, why can't there just be one time where one of her forms doesn't come back like half a dozen times?

----------


## Fyraltari

> Sigh.  I'm really ready for Lucrezia to just be removed from the story entirely.  Sure, she is the main antagonist but seriously, why can't there just be one time where one of her forms doesn't come back like half a dozen times?


Don't worry, next page, oversized Monahan will tackle her.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

Or gets eaten by a bigger fish.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Is this the point where Agatha engages the Ludicrous Speed drive and blasts a hole right in Lucrezia's head? Or maybe the Winged Rats engage Lucrezia?

I am getting tired of this, though. Monahan mocks Lucrezia, tells her she's dying, and the next time we see her she's no worse off (despite extended combat) and even larger. Is the power of the Flame finite, or not? Are the Princesses using up their power, or not?

EDIT in this strip, last panel, is it possible Clankrezia is gaining power from lightning strikes?

EDIT #2: "Less blather, more science" proposed as a strip title for XXXII.

----------


## sihnfahl

> Is the power of the Flame finite, or not? Are the Princesses using up their power, or not?


It is, reportedly, and you know the answer.

They have as much power as the Plot Demands.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> It is, reportedly, and you know the answer.
> 
> They have as much power as the Plot Demands.


I ask that the plot have some semblance of internal consistency. Don't show me Clankrezia on the verge of death and then show me Clankrezia 100x larger.

----------


## wingnutx

Time for a Great Cetacean to bite her foot off.

----------


## theangelJean

Okay, I'm with Bang in the new comic. _What_ was _that_?

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> Okay, I'm with Bang in the new comic. _What_ was _that_?


not a teleport
riding on the lightning, I guess.

----------


## Ailurus

> Don't worry, next page, oversized Monahan will tackle her.


Congrats, Fyraltari, you called it correctly!

----------


## Fyraltari

> Congrats, Fyraltari, you called it correctly!


Here's another prediction for you: tomorrow morning the sun will rise over the horizon.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Here in Colorado, the rotation of the earth brought the sun into view this morning. Fyraltari missed one.  :Small Big Grin: 

Monahan is doing this correctly; she is ranting about her resentments and pummeling Clankrezia at the same time. Future super-villains of GGverse, take note.

By my reading, Monahan had already tackled Clankrezia prior to Friday's strip, and Clankrezia thought that grabbing the airship was important enough to make the attempt even while being pummeled. Perhaps she thought that grabbing the airship would allow her to transfer to Agatha's body?

Now, what plot complications will ensue from using the "Get Out Of Fist, Free" card? That may have damaged the airship.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Here in Colorado, the rotation of the earth brought the sun into view this morning. Fyraltari missed one.


Believe you me, it *will* happen again tomorrow.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

I think we're working towards a scene where two shrunk-down ex-queens are watching an airship disappear of over the horizon, with a shared speech bubble of "That was _your_ fault!"

----------


## geoduck

> I think we're working towards a scene where two shrunk-down ex-queens are watching an airship disappear of over the horizon, with a shared speech bubble of "That was _your_ fault!"


Possible, though I wouldn't be surprised if we and Our Heroes leave the island without seeing the final outcome of the Queen-fight.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> Possible, though I wouldn't be surprised if we and Our Heroes leave the island without seeing the final outcome of the Queen-fight.


the fight wouldnt be over, just momentarily paused to play the blame game.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I do not think it is likely both Princesses survive to leave the island unless some external force (e.g., a leviathan) intervenes to stop their fight. And right now, I have to bet on Monahan winning; she seems to have the upper hand, and her body is healing while Clankrezia cannot.

In Albia's memory of Lucrezia the Queen Killer, we see her as largely clank / cyborg with only a little human left. In Agatha's vision of Lucrezia (which didn't look exactly like this one), she was entirely a clank. Is it possible that due to time travel shenanigans Lucrezia eventually has to become 100% clank because her body has aged past the point where even she can keep it running?

EDIT: NEW STRIP
Are they using Krosp as a weapon? Against giant winged rats? Gotta agree with His Majesty: Why?

----------


## Scarlet Knight

I am curious why Agatha is in this precarious position. She has both Zeetha and the Baron's favorite killer who could be outside in combat. I guess she is the only person who can fix the balloon with a wrench ...on the outside...in mid-flight.

----------


## sihnfahl

> I am curious why Agatha is in this precarious position. She has both Zeetha and the Baron's favorite killer who could be outside in combat. I guess she is the only person who can fix the balloon with a wrench ...on the outside...in mid-flight.


She SPARKED the engine.  Unless they have a minion somewhere in the crew...

----------


## Rockphed

"A Short distance, Very Quickly, Backwards" for thread title pile.

----------


## theangelJean

> I am curious why Agatha is in this precarious position. She has both Zeetha and the Baron's favorite killer who could be outside in combat. I guess she is the only person who can fix the balloon with a wrench ...on the outside...in mid-flight.


Also, Bang's driving.

----------


## Mechalich

Rakethorn is outside as well, and he's the only other Spark with them at the moment (which is unusually low Spark density). That certainly suggests some sort of Sparky exterior requirements.

----------


## theangelJean

There was also some speculation a few threads back about Violetta breaking through at some point. But I guess Agatha called on her earlier because she's known to have good minion skills, at least.
Edit: which begs the question, why does she need Krosp now and not Violetta? A tight space to get into? Or something to do with the balloon bees? I thought Krosp's "whyyyy?!" was more all-purpose whining, but the specifics might be interesting.

----------


## Radar

> There was also some speculation a few threads back about Violetta breaking through at some point. But I guess Agatha called on her earlier because she's known to have good minion skills, at least.
> Edit: which begs the question, why does she need Krosp now and not Violetta? A tight space to get into? Or something to do with the balloon bees? I thought Krosp's "whyyyy?!" was more all-purpose whining, but the specifics might be interesting.


Aside from tight spaces, there might be a simple case of that structure they are standing on not being able to hold more people and despite his eating habits Krosp is pretty light. This would also explain, why they do not have there anyone to fend off the flying rats.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> "A Short distance, Very Quickly, Backwards" for thread title pile.


Duly piled.


I suspect Krosp is required because he smells like a cat, and so might give some level of deterrent to the rats.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Duly piled.
> 
> 
> I suspect Krosp is required because he smells like a cat, and so might give some level of deterrent to the rats.


I have a vague recollection that his vocalizations drove them off, so maybe he needs to yowl menacingly.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Well, he's got the yowling bit down...

----------


## sihnfahl

> I have a vague recollection that his vocalizations drove them off, so maybe he needs to yowl menacingly.


But he didn't have to be seen to do that one.  Plus, it'd be easier to do from inside.  No, they need him for another reason.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Krosp is having too much fun. Now he may not want to come back inside.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Rockphed

I want to work "because they are mine", "Haha! They Were" into a thread title, but I can't think of any good ways to do it.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

"Because they're mine!" might work on its own, but I don't see much hope for the other, let alone combining them.

----------


## Shining Wrath

"Rub them together, and aim!" might be succinct enough to be a title, but I don't want to nominate it. Not funny enough out of context.
Also, I count 5 Ka-booms, so Krosp is effectively reducing the number of flying rats.

Why are the rats even here? Shouldn't they be nibbling on tasty exposed wires of Clankrezia?

----------


## Fyraltari

> "Rub them together, and aim!" might be succinct enough to be a title, but I don't want to nominate it. Not funny enough out of context.
> Also, I count 5 Ka-booms, so Krosp is effectively reducing the number of flying rats.
> 
> Why are the rats even here? Shouldn't they be nibbling on tasty exposed wires of Clankrezia?


I don't think Monahan has this kind of control over them. They're probably attacking anything that moves and doesn't smell like a fellow rat in a wild rush.

----------


## theangelJean

> I don't think Monahan has this kind of control over them. They're probably attacking anything that moves and doesn't smell like a fellow rat in a wild rush.


Come to that, have we ever seen any spark display any degree of control over any non-sentient creation? Sentient creations can be reasoned with or befriended, wasped beings can be mind-controlled, but giving orders to monsters has always been shown to end very badly.

----------


## Grim Portent

I think it's contingent on the level of mental conditioning they've been through, and how they're treated.

A well treated monster with loyalty ingrained is going to be a decent servant.

A poorly treated guard slime who's mainly designed to be hungry and angry is not a good servant.

It's like a dog, or any other animal really. Treat them well and try to understand them and most are going to be obediant and loyal, treat them badly or without regard to their natural instincts and they become obedient only due to fear, or actively hostile depending on the circumstances.


Monahan's rats, well they do seem to be friendly under the right circumstances, and are willing to sing along to Monahan's organ, so I'd guess they do actually like her even if giving them intricate orders isn't necessarily easy.

----------


## Shining Wrath

OK, two new monsters enter the fray. What are they, where did they come from, and will they interfere in the Princess throw-down?

----------


## Kantaki

> OK, two new monsters enter the fray. What are they, where did they come from, and will they interfere in the Princess throw-down?


I think those are the rides of those mutant fish people.

----------


## theangelJean

> I think those are the rides of those mutant fish people.


Okay, that would make sense ... But also mean that they're flying _really_ low?

And they just went ... looks like downwards? Perspective might make it "away" but can't tell yet.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> I think those are the rides of those mutant fish people.


If they are, they've gotten a lot bigger since we last saw them.

----------


## Shining Wrath

The rides of the mutant fish people resembled corrupted whales, and didn't have arms, and didn't come up onto land.

Also, Bang may have just made a mistake - maybe not as big of a mistake as holding her position would have been, but they might be on the ground or close to it.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Okay, that would make sense ... But also mean that they're flying _really_ low?


They're in a blimp. Going up takes time.

----------


## Radar

> They're in a blimp. Going up takes time.


Especially when half (I think) of the buoyancy tanks are compromised due to bee infestation.

----------


## Kantaki

> The rides of the mutant fish people resembled corrupted whales, and didn't have arms, and didn't come up onto land.


They look pretty similar to me.
Of course that might just mean they're both affected by the "sufficiently advanced technology*" that was spilled earlier/gets thrown around right now.

*Magic. It's magic.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> They look pretty similar to me.
> Of course that might just mean they're both affected by the "sufficiently advanced technology*" that was spilled earlier/gets thrown around right now.
> 
> *Magic. It's magic.


Creatures mutated by the safe stuff != same creatures. I think these bad boys are cousins to the mutated fish landing whales. What was mutated to produce them, I do not know.

Whatever they are, they are more horrific than they appear, at least when viewed in the rear view mirror.

----------


## sihnfahl

> Also, Bang may have just made a mistake


Well, to be fair, you'd think that pushing the control UP would move the ship up!

It's aeronautics.  Moving the control up makes you go down...

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

Is this still above the island?
Looks a bit other dimension.

----------


## f00bar

yeah, i already wondered whether this is where Vapnoople pops up again...

----------


## Shining Wrath

The plot armor is thick about that airship, but still, that's a whole lotta monsters.
Vapnoople definitely possible. I doubt the Princess battle did this.
One can see why even a leviathan would be concerned.

Aside from dimensional hijinks, is it possible that the entire party is hallucinating? And remember that Zeetha was hallucinating while traveling to Europa from Skifander? Those monsters look even weirder than the corrupted minions / fish folk.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> Aside from dimensional hijinks, is it possible that the entire party is hallucinating? And remember that Zeetha was hallucinating while traveling to Europa from Skifander? Those monsters look even weirder than the corrupted minions / fish folk.


It's possible, sure, but why would they be hallucinating? Zeetha's hallucinations were caused by her illness, not by being in an airship.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> It's possible, sure, but why would they be hallucinating? Zeetha's hallucinations were caused by her illness, not by being in an airship.


Why? Something about the border of Skifander? It's a defense against invasion, it doesn't always work? Mumble mumble wave hands vaguely....

Most likely this is just Phil having fun with weird art. But possibly those things look so weird because they aren't real.

----------


## eee

There were monsters galore under the island.  Kestle and Train ran into them in their explorations.  With Lu destroying the island, naturally they're popping up.

----------


## Radar

> There were monsters galore under the island.  Kestle and Train ran into them in their explorations.  With Lu destroying the island, naturally they're popping up.


I think that's it and on top of that copious amounts of eldritch energies are being spread around by the fighting princesses, the dyne-like water might also be flooding everything since the island itself is crumbling and I think that kind of contaminant spillage might also make the mutations progressively worse.

Still, I would not be surprised if that experimental engine Agatha put together was making the airship travel in not just our regular Cartesian coordinates.

edit: basically, we are going for this kind of situation in terms of the difference from a local "normal" situation.

----------


## Shining Wrath

The monsters Castle and Train encountered didn't look like these creatures. They look like bog-standard deep sea dwellers, not even corrupted.

But the Princess battle combined with effluvia might have done terrible things to the poor monsters.

----------


## theangelJean

I wonder if Agatha's modified engine is actually doing weird things with time, and they're moving into a dimension with monsters, rather than monsters appearing where they were?

Edit: they do look like they're just noticing the ship, rather than converging on the area. I am starting to think that it's the ship that has arrived where they are, rather than the other way around.

----------


## geoduck

> I wonder if Agatha's modified engine is actually doing weird things with time, and they're moving into a dimension with monsters, rather than monsters appearing where they were?
> 
> Edit: they do look like they're just noticing the ship, rather than converging on the area. I am starting to think that it's the ship that has arrived where they are, rather than the other way around.


Maybe the ship is contributing, but it's going to be Vapnoople who is the main cause.

----------


## Fyraltari

> I wonder if Agatha's modified engine is actually doing weird things with time, and they're moving into a dimension with monsters, rather than monsters appearing where they were?
> 
> Edit: they do look like they're just noticing the ship, rather than converging on the area. I am starting to think that it's the ship that has arrived where they are, rather than the other way around.


Monahan and Lucrezia can see the monsters too and they aren't on the ship.

----------


## Radar

I think it is not about the engine and more about the nature of The Flame. Basically, the energy has to be drawn from somewhere. Considering that Snackleford has achieved a similar state to Queenhood by directly tapping into energy from other dimension, maybe Flames are basically natural or manufactured cracks in reality letting other-dimensional energies into the world. With the island getting destroyed whatever system held things stable was probably crushed to bits and the realities get mixed up as a result.

----------


## Pax1138

Whatever's happening, at least we have confirmation that the characters are as confused as we are.

----------


## Kantaki

Oh No? I hope you didn't drop the princess.
The Queen might be somewhat unamused.
Also, she's cool. :Small Amused:

----------


## theangelJean

> Oh No? I hope you didn't drop the princess.
> The Queen might be somewhat unamused.
> Also, she's cool.


There's a dot in kind of the right place below the airship in the second-last panel...

Hello, Neenacrezia?

----------


## Shining Wrath

Vapnoople returning from other dimension, now with added insanity, is a definite possibility.

----------


## Radar

> Vapnoople returning from other dimension, now with added insanity, is a definite possibility.


As in *more* insanity than before? That being said, why would he appear here out of all the places?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> As in *more* insanity than before? That being said, why would he appear here out of all the places?


Because the Princess battle has opened a dimensional portal to wherever he got sent during the Stackpole battle.

----------


## Grim Portent

Or because he's chasing Agatha and Krosp for 'betraying' him. He has genuine reasons to be trying to shadow them in whatever dimension he wound up in, and is likely scheming to get revenge.

----------


## Mobius Twist

Vapnoople is likely, but maybe the Leviathans can now approach the area, the party having messed about with the toxins that were leaking into the surrounding water. We may see why they are considered as scary as they are.

----------


## Shining Wrath

"Song Keeper" meaning one of the ancient leviathans has been corrupted? We're talking "end of civilization" level threat, then. If that guy can deliver a thousand monsters, each 10x the size of an airship, to Londonium or Marseille or Athens, who or what will stop them?

----------


## Fyraltari

How deep is the water in these parts?




> "Song Keeper" meaning one of the ancient leviathans has been corrupted? We're talking "end of civilization" level threat, then. If that guy can deliver a thousand monsters, each 10x the size of an airship, to Londonium or Marseille or Athens, who or what will stop them?


I mean, it looks like it's dying.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> How deep is the water in these parts?
> 
> 
> I mean, it looks like it's dying.


Is corruption fatal? I see it as looking like all the other corrupted things we've seen, including Monahan's minions, and I think those survived for a while behind the door with the sign on it.

Water depth has not been established; we don't know if this island rises from the depths, like Hawaii, or is part of a shallow archipelago, like the UK.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Is corruption fatal? I see it as looking like all the other corrupted things we've seen, including Monahan's minions, and I think those survived for a while behind the door with the sign on it.


I mean, it looks like death warmed over.




> Water depth has not been established; we don't know if this island rises from the depths, like Hawaii, or is part of a shallow archipelago, like the UK.


Oh, yeah, I forgot they're no longer in the British Isles.

----------


## eee

Oh.

I didn't expect HER.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I mean, it looks like death warmed over.
> 
> 
> Oh, yeah, I forgot they're no longer in the British Isles.


The corrupted are possessed of great ickyness, but so are D&D oozes, and they live for a long time.

----------


## sihnfahl

> I didn't expect HER.


NOBODY expects the Spanish Inquisition corrupted leviathan filled with corrupted fishmen.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

That is a big fish.  :Small Eek:

----------


## Shining Wrath

> That is a big fish.


You shoulda seen the one that got away; this one is the one they're getting away from.

----------


## theangelJean

> Water depth has not been established; we don't know if this island rises from the depths, like Hawaii, or is part of a shallow archipelago, like the UK.


Maybe the island was the Song Keeper?

Also, I wasn't expecting Adrian Rakethorne to be the one to recognise it, but I guess someone had to. Did we see a Song Keeper on panel in the comic before, or did we only ever meet Leviathans?

----------


## Fyraltari

> That is a big fish.


Please, one time I caught a fish *moves hands away from each other* _that_ big.

----------


## sihnfahl

> Maybe the island was the Song Keeper?


No.  It was corrupted by the runoff from the island, though.




> Also, I wasn't expecting Adrian Rakethorne to be the one to recognise it, but I guess someone had to. Did we see a Song Keeper on panel in the comic before, or did we only ever meet Leviathans?


No.  The Great Cetaceans remarked that it had been corrupted a while back, and they went out of their way to avoid it because it was ... maddened.

But we never saw it.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> No.  It was corrupted by the runoff from the island, though.
> 
> 
> No.  The Great Cetaceans remarked that it had been corrupted a while back, and they went out of their way to avoid it because it was ... maddened.
> 
> But we never saw it.


And it's making them mad, too.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

"It's bigger than the Island!"

Yup. Adrian knowing that this is the Song Keeper specifically makes a lot more sense now...

----------


## Willie the Duck

> That is a big fish.


Not as big as the one I almost caught the other day, you should have seen it...

----------


## Gez

> "Song Keeper" meaning one of the ancient leviathans has been corrupted? We're talking "end of civilization" level threat, then. If that guy can deliver a thousand monsters, each 10x the size of an airship, to Londonium or Marseille or Athens, who or what will stop them?


For Londinium I don't know; but for Marseilles and Athens I'd say the thing that will stop them is having to squeeze through the Straits of Gibraltar.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> For Londinium I don't know; but for Marseilles and Athens I'd say the thing that will stop them is having to squeeze through the Straits of Gibraltar.


At its narrowest point, the Strait of Gibraltar is just over eight miles wide. The Song Keeper is big, but it's not that big.

----------


## Gez

> At its narrowest point, the Strait of Gibraltar is just over eight miles wide. The Song Keeper is big, but it's not that big.


And at its shallowest point, it's only 280 meters deep. That beastie would have to crawl along the floor.

Not that it could hope to swim effectively anyway, due to anything over 100 meters in draft suffering from dead water effect... Sometimes big isn't beautiful.

----------


## Grim Portent

I'd be willing to bet that the exposure to the corrupted spring has made it fully capable of walking on land, at least for short periods of time. Major physical mutation and enhanced strength are the primary effects, so it's plausible that it's fins have become stubby clawed limbs that could drag it over land, and it's presumably an air breather given the whole 'cetacean' thing.

I'm curious as to what exactly it was carrying around before the mutation began, the miscellaneous monsters it's spitting up don't really look like sea creatures. I wonder if they're just supposed to be that extremely mutated that they lost all resemblence to their original form, or if the song keeper is meant to have had a smorgasboard of lifeforms from different places all living in it.

----------


## geoduck

> And at its shallowest point, it's only 280 meters deep. That beastie would have to crawl along the floor.
> 
> Not that it could hope to swim effectively anyway, due to anything over 100 meters in draft suffering from dead water effect... Sometimes big isn't beautiful.


We've seen a depiction of one of the Great Cetaceans swimming, so unsurprisingly they've found a way to deal with the problem.

----------


## Gez

> We've seen a depiction of one of the Great Cetaceans swimming, so unsurprisingly they've found a way to deal with the problem.


I was talking specifically about swimming across the Straits of Gibraltar, not about swimming in general.

The dead water effect is when a ship (or a giant mutant fish) is big enough that 1. it crosses the halocline and cannot be entirely within one of the water layers and 2. the two water layers flow in opposite directions. Which is the case for the Straits of Gibraltar, as you have the Atlantic water flowing into the sea on the top and the much more saline Mediterranean water flowing out to the ocean on the bottom. The ship (or giant mutant fish) being caught between the two opposite flow will end up "getting stuck in dead water".

This phenomenon is usually only encountered in fjords, where the layer of fresh water is thin enough that ships can realistically have a draft tall enough to cross the halocline and get stuck. But that thing here is easily over 300 meters tall, and the halocline in the Straits of Gibraltar is at around 100 meters.

----------


## smuchmuch

Look I like nerding over physics and versimilitude of realism as much as the next person but as far this comic is concerned... 
This is a comic about time travel, talking cats, steampunk mad "science" that is effetively magic by any other name and that has abandonned any sense of versimilitude of even having rules beyond rule of cool and absolute plot armor for it's protagonists a while ago. Do you think a creature that obviously ignore so hapilly the square cube law and all rules of biology that comes with it (a thing so big that an entire flying cavalry squadron came through it's pupil !) would care about the Dead water effect ? Besides the song keeper would just float over the straight of Gibraltar with the "totaly scientific" power of reality altering whale songs or giant steampunk mecha lobster

Anyhow what's important right now is that it's another threat interrupting the queen fight and tje retreat of our protagonists. Also it lost an eye. Let's not think too hard as to what could wound that thing so.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> This is a comic about time travel, talking cats, steampunk mad "science" that is effetively magic by any other name.


Sufficiently Advanced Biology?

----------


## WanderingMist

Love this comic. Need to catch up. Read the entire thing in like October 2020 I think and haven't read a page since because I like having a lot of it to read but I want to collect all the volumes in printed form.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Bang is going to have big monster eat hordes of smaller monsters. She only has to risk total annihilation to do it.

----------


## St Fan

Yup, Bang opted for an insanely dangerous stunt. Which means it's probably crazy enough to work.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Cue Othar Trygvassen: Agatha is a hero at heart. Also, green monster is about to eat a wrench.

----------


## geoduck

> Cue Othar Trygvassen: Agatha is a hero at heart. Also, green monster is about to eat a wrench.


My immediate thought was hoping they don't need that wrench when working on the engines.

----------


## f00bar

New comic.
Sparky Princess Neena confirmed?

----------


## Shining Wrath

Even monsters are afraid of MegaClankrezia (panel 3).

I think perhaps Albia is about to pay a visit, using Neena as a vessel. The "you want to be a Queen? Let me show you what that really is" moment. Possibly involving the death of Neena, because sacrifices must sometimes be made for the good of the realm. It'd be a dark twist.

Or we'll get yet another Rescued By Monahan moment.

Or perhaps the Song Keeper will decide Clankrezia looks tasty.

----------


## sihnfahl

Or Neena is going to have a Spark moment of her own.  She DID just ... 'snap'.

----------


## Rockphed

> Or Neena is going to have a Spark moment of her own.  She DID just ... 'snap'.


And Mommy has a very clear "no sparky daughters" rule, so Neena has been suppressing her spark for over a decade.  She will make a fitting distraction for Tarvek.

----------


## geoduck

> And Mommy has a very clear "no sparky daughters" rule, so Neena has been suppressing her spark for over a decade.  She will make a fitting distraction for Tarvek.


Very clear? We don't know that Albia has that rule, or that Neena has been suppressing anything. We still don't even know if her daughters are biologically related to her. She did declare at one point that Agatha was to be treated as a princess of the realm.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Citation needed on "no Sparky daughters", especially because she does tolerate non-family Sparks. We still don't know how Queen Albia goes about producing children - parthenogenesis? Sparky science? Or normal "boink followed by 9 months gestation"?

----------


## InvisibleBison

> We still don't know how Queen Albia goes about producing children - parthenogenesis? Sparky science? Or normal "boink followed by 9 months gestation"?


I see no reason to assume she produces all her children through the same process. Variety is the spice of life, after all.

----------


## theangelJean

> Very clear? We don't know that Albia has that rule, or that Neena has been suppressing anything. We still don't even know if her daughters are biologically related to her. She did declare at one point that Agatha was to be treated as a princess of the realm.


Actually I've been wondering if Neena's lack of sparkiness is directly related to proximity to Albia in another way - and also the reason Albia wants to keep Agatha. The oblique references to Albia's "safe power source" and the Garden ... Is Albia draining them somehow?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Actually I've been wondering if Neena's lack of sparkiness is directly related to proximity to Albia in another way - and also the reason Albia wants to keep Agatha. The oblique references to Albia's "safe power source" and the Garden ... Is Albia draining them somehow?


I think the "safe power source" is likely a Flame, since Clankrezia spoke of using Albia's Flame to complete ascension.

That doesn't preclude Albia's Garden from being full of sinister delights such as captive Sparks used as batteries when the Flame is ebbing. Royal prerogatives and all that.

Myself, I don't see how Neena breaking through saves her & Agatha from Clankrezia. She's got no weapons or tools handy.

However, Krosp can fly, and has the Gloves of Static Shock. He could try to do something.

----------


## Gez

> Myself, I don't see how Neena breaking through saves her & Agatha from Clankrezia. She's got no weapons or tools handy.


She didn't break through, but she did cast Summon Bigger Fish.

----------


## Jimorian

I like how this is literally a case of 
*Spoiler*
Show

"My mom can beat up your mom!"

----------


## Fyraltari

This might have come in handy at school.

----------


## Ailurus

I'm rather confused right now.

We know that - on multiple occasions - princesses have gotten kidnapped, to the point where there are special laws just regarding reclaiming them.  But, if the princesses can just summon Albia as will to save them, why isn't that done more often when they get in danger?  Is there some level of system Albia teaches her princesses as to when they can summon mom?  Or is Neena a favorite?  Or something else?

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> I'm rather confused right now.
> 
> We know that - on multiple occasions - princesses have gotten kidnapped, to the point where there are special laws just regarding reclaiming them.  But, if the princesses can just summon Albia as will to save them, why isn't that done more often when they get in danger?  Is there some level of system Albia teaches her princesses as to when they can summon mom?  Or is Neena a favorite?  Or something else?


Theres kidnapping as an opportunity for heroic rescues
and here is existential threat by Archnemesis.

----------


## Rockphed

> Very clear? We don't know that Albia has that rule, or that Neena has been suppressing anything. We still don't even know if her daughters are biologically related to her. She did declare at one point that Agatha was to be treated as a princess of the realm.





> Citation needed on "no Sparky daughters", especially because she does tolerate non-family Sparks. We still don't know how Queen Albia goes about producing children - parthenogenesis? Sparky science? Or normal "boink followed by 9 months gestation"?


I was extrapolating on someone else's wild-mass-guess.  Sorry if that wasn't clear.

As for why the princesses don't call on Mama very often, I suspect that Albia would deal harshly with any of her daughters who called on her frivolously.

----------


## theangelJean

> Theres kidnapping as an opportunity for heroic rescues
> and here is existential threat by Archnemesis.


Possibly even more so than Neena realises. Does Team Agatha know about Clankrezia's current Summoning Engine capabilities?

----------


## InvisibleBison

> I'm rather confused right now.
> 
> We know that - on multiple occasions - princesses have gotten kidnapped, to the point where there are special laws just regarding reclaiming them.  But, if the princesses can just summon Albia as will to save them, why isn't that done more often when they get in danger?  Is there some level of system Albia teaches her princesses as to when they can summon mom?  Or is Neena a favorite?  Or something else?


It may be that Albia is only able or willing to appear like this inside her realm.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

It's always the quiet ones, isn't it...

We know from Trelawney that Albia does allow this, and trusts the people she gives the ability to to know when it is appropriate to use it.

That said, from their interactions I suspect that Neena is something of a favourite with Albia. Not much evidence, but it is there.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> It may be that Albia is only able or willing to appear like this inside her realm.


I think it has been put forward that while Queens may be able to teleport short distances, for long distances the mirrors were required. It's also possible that she wasn't far away from this island to begin with, she knew where they were going, and she might have suspected what was going to go down here, or at least that her presence might be called on.

This also may be the end of Albia, not unlike the Master of Paris... or at least a major diminishing. Lucrezia had mentioned that the Queens power was waning more than she let on, and she's going to be using up a lot of flame fighting two other queens and a mad Deepdweller this far from her own well. She'll win, or at least save our heroes, but it's going to cost her.

While it's not surprising that her daughter had a "summon mom/get out of trouble free" card it does feel a little like Deus Ex Machina for the second time with Alba.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> While it's not surprising that her daughter had a "summon mom/get out of trouble free" card it does feel a little like Deus Ex Machina for the second time with Alba.


Its not Deus Ex if its known to be likely.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

She the goddess of Currency?

----------


## Traab

This could be interesting. Albia, probably a projection of her, versus two half crippled partial queens both dying and these deepdweller monsters. This is an awful mess. I cant wait to see what happens next.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Albia looks to be 2x or 3x the size of the Princesses. I'm sure killing the Song Keeper would  be a major diplomatic faux pas, but no one will mind if Clankrezia and Monahan go away.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

A simple ROFL-Stomp on the wannabe queens is probably too much to ask for.

----------


## geoduck

I assume Monahan will at least try to surrender, she was scared of Albia doing exactly this.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I hope Albia doesnt monologue. Kill or subdue the Princesses, save your daughter, go home.

----------


## wingnutx

Monahan is about to get a boost.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Lucrezia thinks she can one shot Albia. I think she's about to be surprised.

----------


## Pax1138

> Lucrezia thinks she can one shot Albia. I think she's about to be surprised.


Is she trying to one-shot her, or is that the brain-taker-over-thingie?  Granted, I doubt that'd go over well either.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> Is she trying to one-shot her, or is that the brain-taker-over-thingie?  Granted, I doubt that'd go over well either.


The brain-taker-over-thingie seems to require physical touch (seen with Steelgarter holding Monahan and how Lu tried to reach the airship). This looks like aiming for a shot.

----------


## wingnutx

Pretty sure that's her anti-queen deathray.

Albia has probably been doing some research and buffing her defenses since her epiphany about Lucrezia.

----------


## Ailurus

Sneaky Gate is alive again.

*Spoiler*
Show





> Pretty sure that's her anti-queen deathray.
> 
> Albia has probably been doing some research and buffing her defenses since her epiphany about Lucrezia.


It was the deathray, but doesn't look like Albia has been doing much to improve her defenses.

----------


## Pax1138

So much for that theory. :P

And not a good showing for the Queen of England either.  I guess we can chalk this up to Lu's unmatched experience in Queen killing?

----------


## sihnfahl

> I guess we can chalk this up to Lu's unmatched experience in Queen killing?


And Albia's overconfidence.

Think, say, Luthor pointing a normal gun at Superman.  Oh, no, another gun?  But it has kryptonite bullets.  Oops.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

If the Paris storyline is anything to go by, Lucrezia is about to be completely blindsided by a very angry Neena.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Having stunned Albia with her anti-queen ray, Clankrezia must resort to punching to finish her off? How primitive. 

I am very surprised Albia wasnt prepared for this.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

what we need now:
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...6#.YuGPFvLRYgo

----------


## wingnutx

> So much for that theory. :P



I am here to chew bubblegum and propose bad theories, and I'm all out of bubblegum.

----------


## geoduck

> If the Paris storyline is anything to go by, Lucrezia is about to be completely blindsided by a very angry Neena.


It will be Agatha who does something, not Neena. What exactly, I have no idea.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> And Albia's overconfidence.
> 
> Think, say, Luthor pointing a normal gun at Superman.  Oh, no, another gun?  But it has kryptonite bullets.  Oops.





> I am very surprised Albia wasnt prepared for this.


I agree with Shining Wrath, overconfident or not, Albia knew about Lu's queen killing, and that the party's efforts would be intersecting with her. She should have known that the gun had kryptonite bullets, so to speak. At the very least she should have come in swinging, rather than just stand there posturing and letting Lu get in the first shot.

----------


## sihnfahl

> I agree with Shining Wrath, overconfident or not, Albia knew about Lu's queen killing, and that the party's efforts would be intersecting with her. She should have known that the gun had kryptonite bullets, so to speak. At the very least she should have come in swinging, rather than just stand there posturing and letting Lu get in the first shot.


Yes, she should have, but hey, hubris.

And the idiot ball.

The Foglios have to have some reason Agatha will be forced to leave England.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Of course, Albia could be about to stand up and cry Psych!. Or Monahan could earn mercy.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> It will be Agatha who does something, not Neena. What exactly, I have no idea.


Agatha will only play a minor part. This is all to show how outgunned she is.

----------


## eee

I wonder if Lu is ever going to grasp the idea, "gloat AFTER you've killed your enemy, not before!"

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> I wonder if Lu is ever going to grasp the idea, "gloat AFTER you've killed your enemy, not before!"


What would be the point of that? 
 :Small Wink:

----------


## Fyraltari

> What would be the point of that?


Stress relief?

----------


## PoeticallyPsyco

> I wonder if Lu is ever going to grasp the idea, "gloat AFTER you've killed your enemy, not before!"





> What would be the point of that?





> Stress relief?


If it's good enough for James Bond, it should be good enough for you.

----------


## Ellen

For once, I agree with Lu. I don't know what happened either. But, I'm looking forward to finding out.

----------


## Kantaki

If Lu is smart there's nothing actually important up there.

----------


## Drogorn

Looks to me like they exploded the engine.  _Inside_ Lu's head.

----------


## TeChameleon

> If Lu is smart there's nothing actually important up there.


If I'm not mistaken, this is still (more or less) the pseudo-muse that Tarvek built way back when.  And, at least with Tarvek's design, the clank's driving intelligence is seated in the head (remember, Luclankzia was offering snarky commentary as a head before being attached to the body).

----------


## Mechalich

> If I'm not mistaken, this is still (more or less) the pseudo-muse that Tarvek built way back when.  And, at least with Tarvek's design, the clank's driving intelligence is seated in the head (remember, Luclankzia was offering snarky commentary as a head before being attached to the body).


At the very least the sensory apparatus is up there. Blinded and deafened is a very substantial setback even if Lucrezia has relocated her brain and/or has some kind of backup system she can use in the absence of a head.

----------


## theangelJean

Last comic the face casing around one of Lu's eyes seemed to have cracked open completely, showing the clank machinery inside. I wondered when that had happened and why, but now it seems like a moot point.

I don't think the engine just exploded, by the way. It's still going "Fwip! Fwip! Fwip!" in there.

----------


## Radar

> Last comic the face casing around one of Lu's eyes seemed to have cracked open completely, showing the clank machinery inside. I wondered when that had happened and why, but now it seems like a moot point.
> 
> I don't think the engine just exploded, by the way. It's still going "Fwip! Fwip! Fwip!" in there.


Surely scoring points pinball-style.  :Small Smile:

----------


## eee

Agatha seems quite pleased at the prospect of blowing her mother's brains out.  

It's justified.

----------


## runeghost

Sooo, I guess....
*Spoiler*
Show

that this incarnation of Lu is *not* going to end up being the Muse of Time?

I guess that will end up being that "original" Lucrezia who is still out there... somewhere/somewhen?

----------


## theangelJean

> Sooo, I guess....
> *Spoiler*
> Show
> 
> that this incarnation of Lu is *not* going to end up being the Muse of Time?
> 
> I guess that will end up being that "original" Lucrezia who is still out there... somewhere/somewhen?


I mean, we have no idea what that engine does, how it works, or if it has knock-on effects.
*Spoiler*
Show

 I think I already speculated that it might have some kind of time travel mechanism - it would make sense for something Agatha makes to unknowingly incorporate that, given that she got a glimpse of the missing professor's work. 


My brain keeps shouting "maybe this is where we get the Other" every time something happens to/with/around Lu, and it's doing it again now, but I'm learning to tune it out  :Small Tongue:

----------


## sihnfahl

> I mean, we have no idea what that engine does, how it works, or if it has knock-on effects.


Even if you got an explanation, you'd just end up going ... SPARKYstuff.

That engine is bouncing around like a .22 in a brainpan.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Looks to me like the airship was in the blast from the destabilized engine taking off Clankrezias face. Also, with no motive power, they are at the mercy of the Song Keeper, Monahan, and / or Albia. This is far from safe, but they do have plot armor.

----------


## Traab

> Looks to me like the airship was in the blast from the destabilized engine taking off Clankrezias face. Also, with no motive power, they are at the mercy of the Song Keeper, Monahan, and / or Albia. This is far from safe, but they do have plot armor.


Yeah but if they take down Lu they remove the real threat to albia who actually kinda LIKES them. Which means its entirely possible they made the scenario safer overall. Lu HAS to be reaching her limits at this point. Half raised, full of poisonous corruption, burning power like its paper in a crematorium after a death struggle against monohan, and now with an engine exploding in her skull. GO DOWN LADY!

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Yeah but if they take down Lu they remove the real threat to albia who actually kinda LIKES them. Which means its entirely possible they made the scenario safer overall. Lu HAS to be reaching her limits at this point. Half raised, full of poisonous corruption, burning power like its paper in a crematorium after a death struggle against monohan, and now with an engine exploding in her skull. GO DOWN LADY!


I suspect Monahan will do for Clankrezia, and then Albia will help Monahan restore the island. This will help the Song Keeper.

----------


## Rakaydos

> Agatha will only play a minor part. This is all to show how outgunned she is.


Her "minor part" is "getting an idea" moments after the Queen appears, playing into a plan the Queen had not yet articulated.

I suspect the Queen was faking her injuries to make Lu overconfident so this would work.

----------


## Zazu Yen

Well, I did not expect that.




> Her "minor part" is "getting an idea" moments after the Queen appears, playing into a plan the Queen had not yet articulated.
> 
> I suspect the Queen was faking her injuries to make Lu overconfident so this would work.


I don't think so, this Luc has a lot of experience taking down queens and saw Albia block a blast in the science dome so no doubt made adjustments. Things could go several different ways here, I'm thinking this version of Luc is done, so it's mostly depending on what Monahan does. She could take this opportunity to try and finish off Aliba, she could turn her attention to (or get swarmed by) the monsters, or she could go after Agatha & company. I don't have a strong since of how this is going to go at all.

I think this versions of Luc (the consciousness, not the body) _might actually be_ the Muse of Time, at least she at one time had a clank body that was far superior to this one (built with a molecular crystal loom) and she's dropped references to personally killing the queens, watching a mirror for 500 years and seeing the passing of thousands of years ("just... you know, different thousands"). I'm beginning to suspect that if the Muse of Time _is_ a version of Luc, it's one that splintered off away from the "let's take over the world" path a long time ago and now has other concerns.

Or it's the remains of Luc after the end of this story, who's been stuck in time fluctuations and alternate dimensions for so long she no longer has a concept of her past. I'm thinking about it's comment "to see humans after so long, is good", since the Muse had probably _only_ been trapped in the for a couple of hundred years at the most, which isn't long for someone who once spent 500 years watching a Queens Mirror, it seems to imply that apart from Van Rijn humans weren't a common sight (unless it was some play-acting to gain their sympathies). Also Luc-in-Agatha seemed to recognize her and knew exactly how to free her, which I haven't been able to reconcile.

----------


## geoduck

> Her "minor part" is "getting an idea" moments after the Queen appears, playing into a plan the Queen had not yet articulated.
> 
> I suspect the Queen was faking her injuries to make Lu overconfident so this would work.


Echoing  Zazu Yen, I disagree. No chance Albia faked getting knocked down with one hit. We've seen hints all along that Lu isn't lying about Albia's power waning, with all sorts of things happening in England that Albia would disapprove of and stop if she was aware of them. I still fully expect her to die at some point, and be replaced as queen by Neena or one of her other mortal daughters.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I think we know a Queens power ebbs with her flame, and Albia is currently at ebb. Clankrezia might have had more difficulty with Albia at max power. Perhaps Queen-killer Lucrezia had some way of knowing when a Flame is weak?

The stars and eyes on Albia in the last strip dont look like fakery.

EDIT:

New strip. Clankrezia is down for the count. I think that if Albia were dead, she'd shrink down to a more normal size, so I'm reading her as "unconscious, at the mercy of the Song Keeper and Monahan, but probably not for long".

----------


## cptnspldng

> Stress relief?


This isn't _that_ kind of comic.

----------


## Mechalich

> I think we know a Queens power ebbs with her flame, and Albia is currently at ebb. Clankrezia might have had more difficulty with Albia at max power. Perhaps Queen-killer Lucrezia had some way of knowing when a Flame is weak?


Albia also teleported in blind, which is probably a position of maximal weakness for anyone, but especially a Queen. She didn't appear to have any active defenses raised at all and may have been forced to take an initial action to prevent herself from falling out of the sky - she initially appeared at a considerable altitude, and big things fall hard - allowing Clankrezia a free shot.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Albia also teleported in blind, which is probably a position of maximal weakness for anyone, but especially a Queen. She didn't appear to have any active defenses raised at all and may have been forced to take an initial action to prevent herself from falling out of the sky - she initially appeared at a considerable altitude, and big things fall hard - allowing Clankrezia a free shot.


She had time to talk, and to know Clankrezia was there and largish. I think she was overconfident, as Clankrezia said while taunting her.

----------


## hajo

Oh well, another swing of clankretia as a Roly-poly toy  :Small Annoyed:

----------


## Fyraltari

I wonder, how many times did Lucrezia get "defeated" in this sequence? Let's count:
One!
Two!
Three!
Four!
Five!
Six!
Seven!
Eight!
Nine!

Nine times was Lucrezia vanquished today! And she's still not down!

I think even Rasputin would say she's overdoing the bit.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Even in book form this will drag out. 

Now, what will Monahan do? Killing Albia might make her Queen of England, and she could use Albia's Flame to complete ascension. On the other hand, Clankrezia has been trying to kill her for hours now, and letting her live is a bad idea.

Albia's expression seems to be more annoyed than frightened. She's clearly combat-capable (POOM!), but at a level that lets her finish off Clankrezia?

Albia refers to the entire airship crew as "children". What does she mean by that? Just the ancient god-Queen speaking to mortals? Or some sort of "adoption"?

----------


## Ailurus

I don't know if I'd count defeat #3 in the list, as it's just a rock falling, but I'll agree on the other 8.  And the overall sentiment I fully agree with - this incarnation needs to have died a few months IRL ago.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> I wonder, how many times did Lucrezia get "defeated" in this sequence? Let's count:
> One!
> Two!
> Three!
> Four!
> Five!
> Six!
> Seven!
> Eight!
> ...


Rasputin didn't really resist death in any major way, it was almost all after the fact propaganda to make the killing sound more awesome. And that's really the difference. If we were hearing the tale from... the minstrel in this story... and he told about the nine times it took for Lucrezia to actually die (maybe a two-page spread or even four), it would be amusing, interesting, and speak to how powerful she is as a threat. This just feels like padding... the kind webcomic artists who don't have the story all mapped out (like I guess I just assume the Foglios do) might do. It seems dissonant.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Rasputin didn't really resist death in any major way, it was almost all after the fact propaganda to make the killing sound more awesome.


Yeah I know, but it's a good story. Also it's likely his corpse did sit up on the pyre, which is always fun and may have kickstarted the rumor.



> And that's really the difference. If we were hearing the tale from... the minstrel in this story... and he told about the nine times it took for Lucrezia to actually die (maybe a two-page spread or even four), it would be amusing, interesting, and speak to how powerful she is as a threat. This just feels like padding... the kind webcomic artists who don't have the story all mapped out (like I guess I just assume the Foglios do) might do. It seems dissonant.


I think this is supposed to be a drawned out death. Lucrezia "comes back" more visibly damaged and unhinged each time. The Foglios are putting her through the wringer ad her last scene (well this version's last scene), it's her still being presented as a threat each time that makes it look more and more ridiculous.

Also, I noticed whil compiling this little list, that the ascension of the Princesses marks the end of a volume and... I am the only one who finds the way this comic is divided very odd? The volumes don't seem to match arcs with set-ups, pay-offs and resolutions of plot points, they just seem to match an arbitrary volume length.

Like in _The Order of the Stick_, the end of each book feels like an ending whereas this just cuts in the middle of a scene.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Yeah I know, but it's a good story. Also it's likely his corpse did sit up on the pyre, which is always fun and may have kickstarted the rumor.
> 
> I think this is supposed to be a drawned out death. Lucrezia "comes back" more visibly damaged and unhinged each time. The Foglios are putting her through the wringer ad her last scene (well this version's last scene), it's her still being presented as a threat each time that makes it look more and more ridiculous.
> 
> Also, I noticed whil compiling this little list, that the ascension of the Princesses marks the end of a volume and... I am the only one who finds the way this comic is divided very odd? The volumes don't seem to match arcs with set-ups, pay-offs and resolutions of plot points, they just seem to match an arbitrary volume length.
> 
> Like in _The Order of the Stick_, the end of each book feels like an ending whereas this just cuts in the middle of a scene.


A point that may be being driven home, at length, is that the clank body can't heal despite access to The Flame, while Monahan still looks healthy. And the Foglios may think they'll sell more books if you need to buy the next one to see how this arc ends.

We saw in earlier strips that when Albia shrinks the process generates heat - she hurt Zeetha's hand. I wonder why she's not roughly a bazillion degrees right now?

----------


## InvisibleBison

> We saw in earlier strips that when Albia shrinks the process generates heat - she hurt Zeetha's hand. I wonder why she's not roughly a bazillion degrees right now?


Maybe she channeled the heat into that POOM.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Maybe she channeled the heat into that POOM.


But she shrank while unconscious and shouldn't have made any decisions at all.

----------


## Traab

Its more likely that clankrezia isnt going down to demonstrate the absolutely inhuman tenacity and determination that has kept her alive and semi sane for these millenia she has been hopscotching around history doing whatever. We still dont have details about much other than she has killed lots of queens and has studied the mirrors for a very long time, but its very clear she has gone through a freaking LOT.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> Its more likely that clankrezia isnt going down to demonstrate the absolutely inhuman tenacity and determination that has kept her alive and semi sane for these millenia she has been hopscotching around history doing whatever. We still dont have details about much other than she has killed lots of queens and has studied the mirrors for a very long time, but its very clear she has gone through a freaking LOT.


I agree with this. Have we ever actually seen an aspect of Lucrezia die? She's practically a force of nature at this point. This is why I suspect the Muse of Time may be an earlier splinter off of Lucrezia that didn't go into the world conquering business but is rather hopscotching around time and possibly dimensions with her own goals. The Lucrezia that invaded Agatha probably knew of her and her interactions with Van Rijn, thus intuiting how to free her, but I don't believe they are the same person. Anymore, anyway. Or not from this timeline.

----------


## Fyraltari

> I agree with this. Have we ever actually seen an aspect of Lucrezia die?


The one in Agatha's head.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> The one in Agatha's head.


She was removed from Agatha and transferred into a container. One host away from being free isn't exactly dead.

----------


## Traab

> The one in Agatha's head.


It didnt die, it was moved to a different container.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I agree with this. Have we ever actually seen an aspect of Lucrezia die? She's practically a force of nature at this point. This is why I suspect the Muse of Time may be an earlier splinter off of Lucrezia that didn't go into the world conquering business but is rather hopscotching around time and possibly dimensions with her own goals. The Lucrezia that invaded Agatha probably knew of her and her interactions with Van Rijn, thus intuiting how to free her, but I don't believe they are the same person. Anymore, anyway. Or not from this timeline.


Still wonder if time-travel Muse Lucrezia didn't see a horrible future and went Full Klaus Wulfenbach to prevent it. "I must rule, because the alternative is rule by the Mime Queen".

----------


## Zazu Yen

> Still wonder if time-travel Muse Lucrezia didn't see a horrible future and went Full Klaus Wulfenbach to prevent it. "I must rule, because the alternative is rule by the Mime Queen".


Indeed. One of my pet theories is that the Muse of Time is Lucrezia from the timeline of Othar's twitter, where Europa ended up a blasted wasteland, and she is now possibly working to prevent that. Which should put her opposed to Lucrezia in part, since Othar believe the Other was responsible for the destruction. Or maybe the Heterodyne boys & Queens caused it in opposition to Lucrezia ("in order to save Europa, we had to destroy it", kind of thing). So maybe SHE told this Lucrezia how to deal with the Queens and kidnapped the Heterodyne boys in this timeline to remove Lucrezia's main competition, not having counted on Agatha filling the power vacuum.

EDIT: The Muse of Time could even be from the time before that. Or from THIS timeline, or the next. Time travel stories are fun! Who knows how many times Time Travel Lucrezia has danced this dance.

----------


## Thales

...Maybe this will finally do her in?


Man, if Tarvek were with the crew, they could have ended all this with two words.

----------


## geoduck

> ...Maybe this will finally do her in?
> 
> 
> Man, if Tarvek were with the crew, they could have ended all this with two words.


Eh, maybe. Now that Lucrezia knows about the issue, she's likely found a way to counter it.

And I doubt this will finish her off, but at least we've learned which side Monahan's joining.

----------


## Shining Wrath

"No one saw this coming", said no one who has been watching this battle play out.

Interesting comment about Albia's power "aging". Not merely that the Flame is at ebb, but that Albia is getting old. Is it possible we're about to see Paris redux, where Albia is trying to hold on until a worthy heir appears?

----------


## Gez

> This just feels like padding... the kind webcomic artists who don't have the story all mapped out (like I guess I just assume the Foglios do) might do. It seems dissonant.


I don't think the plot is all mapped out; notably because we know it has greatly diverged from the original plan.  I know the Castle Heterodyne arc certainly felt like stalling for time, and there also have been various bona fide fillers (paper dolls, Weasel Queen, guest comics...) so I wouldn't be surprised.

Like I'm sure there are points that they have mapped out (closing the time loop from the beginning for example) but the journey between these points?

----------


## Zazu Yen

> I don't think the plot is all mapped out; notably because we know it has greatly diverged from the original plan.  I know the Castle Heterodyne arc certainly felt like stalling for time, and there also have been various bona fide fillers (paper dolls, Weasel Queen, guest comics...) so I wouldn't be surprised.
> 
> Like I'm sure there are points that they have mapped out (closing the time loop from the beginning for example) but the journey between these points?


I doubt the Foglio's ever pad for story plotting reasons. They're long experienced story tellers who I doubt would ever be stuck on a plot point they didn't see coming so long as a single day. Remember the "cork board of continuity madness"? The taking down of a Lucrezia is a momentous occasion and they wan't it to feel that way, it will read much better when not being read a-page-every-other-day, just as the Castle doesn't feel nearly as dragged out when read straight through. They also probably want the big final to be on a chapter break for print reasons.

Monahan knows who'd be next if Aliba was finished off, but "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" deal only lasts so long as there's a common enemy. Maybe she'll try to negotiate a truce afterwords if she gets to keep the island and what's left of the flame here, maybe she'll go for broke and try to claim England for herself. Then we'll probably have another "Master of Paris" type situation though who would claim the throne isn't as clear.

----------


## geoduck

> Monahan knows who'd be next if Aliba was finished off, but "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" deal only lasts so long as there's a common enemy. Maybe she'll try to negotiate a truce afterwords if she gets to keep the island and what's left of the flame here, maybe she'll go for broke and try to claim England for herself. Then we'll probably have another "Master of Paris" type situation though who would claim the throne isn't as clear.


I assume it will be one of Albia's daughters, but hopefully not Neena, as it's pretty clear she isn't remotely ready to take the job.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> I don't think the plot is all mapped out; notably because we know it has greatly diverged from the original plan.  I know the Castle Heterodyne arc certainly felt like stalling for time, and there also have been various bona fide fillers (paper dolls, Weasel Queen, guest comics...) so I wouldn't be surprised.
> 
> Like I'm sure there are points that they have mapped out (closing the time loop from the beginning for example) but the journey between these points?


I doubt the Foglio's ever pad for story plotting reasons. They're long experienced story tellers who I doubt would ever be stuck on a plot point they didn't see coming so long as a single day. Remember the "cork board of continuity madness"? The taking down of a Lucrezia is a momentous occasion and they wan't it to feel that way, it will read much better when not being read a-page-every-other-day, just as the Castle doesn't feel nearly as dragged out when read straight through. They also probably want the big final to be on a chapter break for print reasons.

Monahan knows who'd be next if Aliba was finished off, but "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" deal only lasts so long as there's a common enemy. Maybe she'll try to negotiate a truce afterwords if she gets to keep the island and what's left of the flame here, maybe she'll go for broke and try to claim England for herself. Then we'll probably have another "Master of Paris" type situation though who would claim the throne isn't as clear.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> Monahan knows who'd be next if Aliba was finished off, but "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" deal only lasts so long as there's a common enemy. Maybe she'll try to negotiate a truce afterwords if she gets to keep the island and what's left of the flame here, maybe she'll go for broke and try to claim England for herself. Then we'll probably have another "Master of Paris" type situation though who would claim the throne isn't as clear.


Monahan knows there are other vacant flames, maybe with the help of Albia she can find another one. One that isnt stuck on an island. (or under the sea)

----------


## Shining Wrath

Albia said at the start that not everything was bad, and the picture showed Monahan. I think Albia would welcome a fellow Queen and isn't too judgmental about the morals of that Queen. Also, maybe Monahan can take over this Flame, cleanse it, and fix the Deep Dweller / Song Keeper problem.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Albia said at the start that not everything was bad, and the picture showed Monahan. I think Albia would welcome a fellow Queen and isn't too judgmental about the morals of that Queen. Also, maybe Monahan can take over this Flame, cleanse it, and fix the Deep Dweller / Song Keeper problem.


The Queen of England allowing an Irishwoman to establish another monarchy on a (relatively) close island?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> The Queen of England allowing an Irishwoman to establish another monarchy on a (relatively) close island?


It appears so. Albia must be _very_ lonely to tolerate that, but she refers to Monahan as "sister". I'm unsure if Albia is now large, or if Monahan shrank after Zopping Clankrezia. They seem to be the same size as Clankrezia, but maybe she shrank after being defeated?

Probably the former.

----------


## eee

Albia seems to have recovered quite quickly from Lu's beatdown as soon a Lu went down herself.  I wonder if she was faking to see what Monahan would do.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Albia seems to have recovered quite quickly from Lu's beatdown as soon a Lu went down herself.  I wonder if she was faking to see what Monahan would do.


She did speak of repairing the airship and Poom'd one of the Song Keeper's minions rather casually.

I wonder why Lucrezia didn't "DIE!" Monahan at the start?

----------


## Willie the Duck

> I wonder why Lucrezia didn't "DIE!" Monahan at the start?


Was she perhaps not queenified enough at that point?

----------


## Grim Portent

More likely arrogance, and a bit of cautious power usage.

There's no need to go all out and crush someone with all your power when you can kill them with less, and Lucrezia is prone to underestimating her opponents. If she can defeat Monahan with 5% effort, then why waste 6%? If she can survive 5% then _surely_ she can't handle 8%? So on and so forth.



Notably _this_ Lucrezia has been humbled less often than the one we are used to, not having fought anyone from the main cast until arriving at the undersea dome.

The one we are used to seeing got tricked or overpowered several times, even when she was fully capable of not being beaten because she was overconfident. Hell, she was still being overconfident until the moment she got shoved into the extractor machine.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Albia doesn't seem too upset by the self-destruct mechanism. Is this more arrogance and overconfidence, or are we about to see Albia enter The Madness Place and disarm the self-destruct with a few simple tools?

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Lucrezia tends to be overconfident, and Albia has had milennia to prepare for her next encounter with the thing that was destroying queens.

With respect to Monahan, I'm not overly surprised - Albia has been alone (or at least without a near-equal) for a very long time. She probably welcomes another Queen arising, as long as it isn't Lucrezia  (although I think she was perhaps expecting Agatha to be the one to do it...).

----------


## geoduck

> Albia doesn't seem too upset by the self-destruct mechanism. Is this more arrogance and overconfidence, or are we about to see Albia enter The Madness Place and disarm the self-destruct with a few simple tools?


I figure they'll all just skedaddle, or toss Lucrezia's body out of blast-range.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Well, yes, Albia is recovered enough to take out the trash. "Final word", indeed.

----------


## sihnfahl

> although I think she was perhaps expecting Agatha to be the one to do it...


Not until Mechanicsburg is liberated.  If a Queen is tied to their Flame, then Agatha will not Queen until she has Mechanicsburg and ITS Flame.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Not until Mechanicsburg is liberated.  If a Queen is tied to their Flame, then Agatha will not Queen until she has Mechanicsburg and ITS Flame.


This is why I expect Agatha to reject Queenhood. First, she'd be tied to Mechanicsburg when the whole world needs saving. Secondly, I think Castle would die, or at least be greatly diminished. The Queen of Mechanicsburg exists, sort-of, and serves The Heterodyne because the male Heterodyne rulers wanted it that way. Third, I think it would put her apart from Gil & Tarvek. She'd almost be a different species after ascension.

Worth noting: if Albia intended to fight the Song Keeper, an explosive Clankrezia would be a good weapon. She intends to not harm the corrupted leviathan.

----------


## Traab

Pro tip, suicide techniques should neither beep loudly, nor take long to set off once triggered. The point is to take your enemy down with you, not give them a ten count to escape prepare defenses, or dispose of your carcass.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> Pro tip, suicide techniques should neither beep loudly, nor take long to set off once triggered. The point is to take your enemy down with you, not give them a ten count to escape prepare defenses, or dispose of your carcass.


Ah, but the long beeping is the equivalent of gloating before killing your enemies. Sure, you can skip it, but where is the fun in that?

Also, seeing how this arc turned out so far, I wouldn't be too surprised if some form of Lucrezia came back from the explosion...

----------


## Traab

> Ah, but the long beeping is the equivalent of gloating before killing your enemies. Sure, you can skip it, but where is the fun in that?
> 
> Also, seeing how this arc turned out so far, I wouldn't be too surprised if some form of Lucrezia came back from the explosion...


The beeping should be a distraction. While they panic to get away from the beeping and blinking light, the real death trap was the colorless odorless gas seeping out of your body as the damage accumulated. As the fist of the north star would say, "you are already dead."

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Oh, Lucrezia has form with death traps, countdowns and bluffs. They don't always end the way she expects, though...

This and the following 5 pages.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Lucrezia can't help herself with the gloating. She wants her victims to suffer, knowing she's outwitted them before they die. And she's narcissist enough to not learn from experience, that her victims wind up living because she gloated. No, her plans are PERFECT, and Somebody Else is to blame when the intended victims live.

People who can't admit they've lost, when they've clearly lost, tend to wind up losing a lot. Ironic.

If Lucrezia returns from her clank body exploding out over the ocean I shall be peeved.

----------


## Kantaki

> Lucrezia can't help herself with the gloating. She wants her victims to suffer, knowing she's outwitted them before they die. And she's narcissist enough to not learn from experience, that her victims wind up living because she gloated. No, her plans are PERFECT, and Somebody Else is to blame when the intended victims live.
> 
> People who can't admit they've lost, when they've clearly lost, tend to wind up losing a lot. Ironic.
> 
> If Lucrezia returns from her clank body exploding out over the ocean I shall be peeved.


What did Pratchett say about hoping the guy pointing a weapon at you being evil? :Small Amused: 
Lu is a great example.

Also, Lucrecia will definitely be back. There's too many of her not too. :Small Tongue: 
This particular instance better be dead though, I agree.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> What did Pratchett say about hoping the guy pointing a weapon at you being evil?
> Lu is a great example.
> 
> Also, Lucrecia will definitely be back. There's too many of her not too.
> This particular instance better be dead though, I agree.


at least we got confirmation that the instance in Agathas head is out.
Still running in a jar, but one down is good to see.

----------


## slayerx

> Also, Lucrecia will definitely be back. There's too many of her not too.
> This particular instance better be dead though, I agree.


Actually what I think is interesting about the death of Clankrezia is that we the audience do not know of any other incarnations of lucrezia. We have only seen three made; the first was Agatha who has been extracted and contained, the second was Clankrezia who just exploded, and the last was Zola who actually managed to maintain control. 

This puts the story in an interesting position; we the audience have no idea where lucrezia will pop up next. Lucrezia updated the device so she no longer needs family relatives to create a new calling and it would have been idiotic for her not to do so. It is practically a 100% certainty that she created other avatars of herself... but we have no idea who they are or how and when they will pop up. Any new character that pops up could end up being another Lucrezia. She could even end up being inside a returning character that we have not seen in a long time. There's no telling who she might have picked up in the previous 2 years


Also i feel like Albia is channeling my feelings on this Arc... very tired and desperately in need of a break. The whole God Queen battle between Clankrezia and Monohan just want on too long. Need to get back to the normal sparky shenanigans.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Actually what I think is interesting about the death of Clankrezia is that we the audience do not know of any other incarnations of lucrezia. We have only seen three made; the first was Agatha who has been extracted and contained, the second was Clankrezia who just exploded, and the last was Zola who actually managed to maintain control. 
> 
> This puts the story in an interesting position; we the audience have no idea where lucrezia will pop up next. Lucrezia updated the device so she no longer needs family relatives to create a new calling and it would have been idiotic for her not to do so. It is practically a 100% certainty that she created other avatars of herself... but we have no idea who they are or how and when they will pop up. Any new character that pops up could end up being another Lucrezia. She could even end up being inside a returning character that we have not seen in a long time. There's no telling who she might have picked up in the previous 2 years
> 
> 
> Also i feel like Albia is channeling my feelings on this Arc... very tired and desperately in need of a break. The whole God Queen battle between Clankrezia and Monohan just want on too long. Need to get back to the normal sparky shenanigans.


For maximum irony, there's a Lucrezia inside Othar's head. Possibly, though, inside Zulena (or whoever is leading the rebellion against the Polar Lords).

Monahan looks very frightened of all the monsters. Can't blame her.

And, we get a working airship by Queen ex Machina.

Now - how does Albia know how to fix the Song Keeper? What does she know about corrupted flames, or this particular Flame?

----------


## lord_khaine

Am i the only one who just seriously disliked the introduction of Queens at all?
They removes even the pretense that its Mad Science, and not just sufficiently advanced magic.

----------


## eee

I would have expected Monahan to resist leaving for the sake of her rats, if nothing else.




> Am i the only one who just seriously disliked the introduction of Queens at all?
> They removes even the pretense that its Mad Science, and not just sufficiently advanced magic.


Queens are Mad Science taken to its logical conclusion.  If you're already capable of warping reality through test tubes and machines, eventually you'll figure out how to do it mentally.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Am i the only one who just seriously disliked the introduction of Queens at all?
> They removes even the pretense that its Mad Science, and not just sufficiently advanced magic.


I am more upset that everything is about the Queens now.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> Am i the only one who just seriously disliked the introduction of Queens at all?
> They removes even the pretense that its Mad Science, and not just sufficiently advanced magic.





> Queens are Mad Science taken to its logical conclusion.  If you're already capable of warping reality through test tubes and machines, eventually you'll figure out how to do it mentally.





> I am more upset that everything is about the Queens now.


Generally going to agree with Fyraltari. It is more that these other mega-entities have taken over from Klaus and the Storm King and all the other (except the Other) major players we had going on (in the ranks of which Agatha had to prove she should be considered). I get why certain shows like Stargate SG-1 eventually have to kill off the main threat (less people start to rightly believe that they never will, removing all tension from the show) and find a new epic threat to have to face, but here with all the existing un-wrapped-up plots and thread (including Agatha, Gil and a Geisterdamung going into the future; Vapnoople on the loose; oh, and an entire frozen town), I don't know why we need to switch the story into an battle between the Other and these bizarre superbeing queens.

I kinda agree with both lord_khaine and eee -- Queens are declared to be sufficiently advanced Mad Scientists (who we've sometimes even seen doing the mad science) who have tapped into a incredible power sources*, but they come off as superhero/demigods. 
*and magical waters full of mad science energy has been an existing handwavium in-setting which also you may or may not find breaks your mad-science verisimilitude.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I am more upset that everything is about the Queens now.





> I would have expected Monahan to resist leaving for the sake of her rats, if nothing else.
> 
> 
> 
> Queens are Mad Science taken to its logical conclusion.  If you're already capable of warping reality through test tubes and machines, eventually you'll figure out how to do it mentally.


The story becomes uninteresting if Agatha becomes a Queen. Therefore, we shall learn sooner or later why that's a bad choice for her, if not for Monahan and Albia.

The idea of ascending to Queenhood has been with us since the Castle sequence, years ago. The idea of Albia, eternal god-Queen of England, even longer IIRC. The idea of The Other, despoiler of Europa, has been with us from the early strips. The Other manifestation of Lucrezia is a Queen-killer who aspires to be a Queen, at a minimum, if not a fully or partially ascended Queen.

I submit that perhaps the story has *always* been about Queens, and we're just now realizing it. Especially if you treat the Castle as a quasi-Queen with a Heterodyne twist.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Generally going to agree with Fyraltari. It is more that these other mega-entities have taken over from Klaus and the Storm King and all the other (except the Other) major players we had going on (in the ranks of which Agatha had to prove she should be considered). I get why certain shows like Stargate SG-1 eventually have to kill off the main threat (less people start to rightly believe that they never will, removing all tension from the show) and find a new epic threat to have to face, but here with all the existing un-wrapped-up plots and thread (including Agatha, Gil and a Geisterdamung going into the future; Vapnoople on the loose; oh, and an entire frozen town), I don't know why we need to switch the story into an battle between the Other and these bizarre superbeing queens.
> 
> I kinda agree with both lord_khaine and eee -- Queens are declared to be sufficiently advanced Mad Scientists (who we've sometimes even seen doing the mad science) who have tapped into a incredible power sources*, but they come off as superhero/demigods. 
> *and magical waters full of mad science energy has been an existing handwavium in-setting which also you may or may not find breaks your mad-science verisimilitude.


I think that's the opposite going on. The Queens aren't super Mad-scientists, so much so that they look like magicians, the Sparks are lesser Queens, so little so that they look like (mad) scientists. Basically the Spark is magic, it's just that those who have not undertaken a second breakthrough need to channel it through devices.
I'm not overly fond of the idea.



> The story becomes uninteresting if Agatha becomes a Queen. Therefore, we shall learn sooner or later why that's a bad choice for her, if not for Monahan and Albia.
> 
> The idea of ascending to Queenhood has been with us since the Castle sequence, years ago. The idea of Albia, eternal god-Queen of England, even longer IIRC. The idea of The Other, despoiler of Europa, has been with us from the early strips. The Other manifestation of Lucrezia is a Queen-killer who aspires to be a Queen, at a minimum, if not a fully or partially ascended Queen.
> 
> I submit that perhaps the story has *always* been about Queens, and we're just now realizing it. Especially if you treat the Castle as a quasi-Queen with a Heterodyne twist.


I don't deny that this was always the plan. But initially all of these looked like they were unconnected. We knew Albia was immortal, but we didn't know how, we knew that Der Kestle ran on magic water that almost ascended Agatha but we had no reason to suspect this was linked to Albia. We knew that Lucrezia was a time-travelling cyborg but we had no way to suspect she had any particular beef with Albia. We knew there were mysterious teleporting mirrors, but we didn't know they had any connection to Albia either.

It looked like there was several things going on at once, but it turns out that this all actually go back to one single group we had never heard of before. Our great villain wants to be a Queen, the Mirrors run on the same power source as the Queens, The Castle is mecanical pseudo-Queen, our hero might be turning into a Queen. It turns out there's significantly less going on than we think. Which is pretty ironic for a comic that seems unable to resolve a plot point without opening five more.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I think that's the opposite going on. The Queens aren't super Mad-scientists, so much so that they look like magicians, the Sparks are lesser Queens, so little so that they look like (mad) scientists. Basically the Spark is magic, it's just that those who have not undertaken a second breakthrough need to channel it through devices.
> I'm not overly fond of the idea.
> 
> 
> I don't deny that this was always the plan. But initially all of these looked like they were unconnected. We knew Albia was immortal, but we didn't know how, we knew that Der Kestle ran on magic water that almost ascended Agatha but we had no reason to suspect this was linked to Albia. We knew that Lucrezia was a time-travelling cyborg but we had no way to suspect she had any particular beef with Albia. We knew there were mysterious teleporting mirrors, but we didn't know they had any connection to Albia either.
> 
> It looked like there was several things going on at once, but it turns out that this all actually go back to one single group we had never heard of before. Our great villain wants to be a Queen, the Mirrors run on the same power source as the Queens, The Castle is mecanical pseudo-Queen, our hero might be turning into a Queen. It turns out there's significantly less going on than we think. Which is pretty ironic for a comic that seems unable to resolve a plot point without opening five more.


This is a valid trope (as an aside, tropes aren't intrinsically bad); "As the story progresses, what appears to be chaos resolves into a consistent theme". Perhaps Sparks also require some sort of exposures to a Flame, and there's enough small diffused not-obvious Flames around to keep Europa supplied with Sparks. A genetic predisposition plus gentle Flaming = Spark.

Tying in another major character, Othar will realize that if he can locate and neutralize Flames large and small, he doesn't have to kill the living Sparks. After all, if Flames cause Sparks (rather than genetics), then killing every living Spark is only a momentary respite from Sparky chaos.

Now, what is the price of ascension? Albia seems to be tied to her Flame, and Monahan likely will be as well if we can trust Lucrezia. By which I mean, of course we can't, but she may have accidentally told the truth. Are there other costs?

----------


## Radar

What is - I think - an important information we gained from the whole island arc is that even the queens themselves do not really understand the source of their power as the flame seems to be specifically connected to some arcane devices way older than the queens themselves built be people we know nothing about and who, for instance, left a mirror network behind them.

It all actually makes you wonder, what actually made the sacred vow made by Embi real and is it somehow related to all that ancient tech?

----------


## Rodin

> Actually what I think is interesting about the death of Clankrezia is that we the audience do not know of any other incarnations of lucrezia. We have only seen three made; the first was Agatha who has been extracted and contained, the second was Clankrezia who just exploded, and the last was Zola who actually managed to maintain control. 
> 
> This puts the story in an interesting position; we the audience have no idea where lucrezia will pop up next. Lucrezia updated the device so she no longer needs family relatives to create a new calling and it would have been idiotic for her not to do so. It is practically a 100% certainty that she created other avatars of herself... but we have no idea who they are or how and when they will pop up. Any new character that pops up could end up being another Lucrezia. She could even end up being inside a returning character that we have not seen in a long time. There's no telling who she might have picked up in the previous 2 years
> 
> 
> Also i feel like Albia is channeling my feelings on this Arc... very tired and desperately in need of a break. The whole God Queen battle between Clankrezia and Monohan just want on too long. Need to get back to the normal sparky shenanigans.



Except there is still the mystery of why we arent ass-deep in Lucrezias by now.  Why no new advancements have been made in Slaver tech other than by her known associates from before she disappeared.

My theory is that only Lucrezia-in-Agatha had the ability to modify the summoning engine, because neither of the other copies had the Spark.  We havent seen more Lucrezias because there arent any.

From a story perspective this seems prudent for two reasons:

1)If endless replication is possible it strains belief that Team Good Guy hasnt already lost.  Each version of Lucrezia has been shown to be a top-level threat.  It took our entire squad of protagonists gathered together to deal with ONE.  How do they deal with 10 in one place? 100? 1000?

2)A story like this needs to have a definitive ending.  If there are an arbitrary number of Lucrezias out there, its impossible to win.  Because theres always the possibility you missed one, and that Lucrezia can make a summoning engine, and repeat ad infinitum, ad nauseum.  If something has prevented copying you have a set number of Lucrezias and can come to a decisive final victory.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Except there is still the mystery of why we arent ass-deep in Lucrezias by now.  Why no new advancements have been made in Slaver tech other than by her known associates from before she disappeared.
> 
> My theory is that only Lucrezia-in-Agatha had the ability to modify the summoning engine, because neither of the other copies had the Spark.  We havent seen more Lucrezias because there arent any.
> 
> From a story perspective this seems prudent for two reasons:
> 
> 1)If endless replication is possible it strains belief that Team Good Guy hasnt already lost.  Each version of Lucrezia has been shown to be a top-level threat.  It took our entire squad of protagonists gathered together to deal with ONE.  How do they deal with 10 in one place? 100? 1000?
> 
> 2)A story like this needs to have a definitive ending.  If there are an arbitrary number of Lucrezias out there, its impossible to win.  Because theres always the possibility you missed one, and that Lucrezia can make a summoning engine, and repeat ad infinitum, ad nauseum.  If something has prevented copying you have a set number of Lucrezias and can come to a decisive final victory.


I think we have reason to believe Agatha will eventually engage in time travel shenanigans. If she can kill ur-Lucrezia before there are any copies made, she creates a branch of reality where there is no Other. The knock-on consequences of that would be interesting.

----------


## geoduck

> What is - I think - an important information we gained from the whole island arc is that even the queens themselves do not really understand the source of their power as the flame seems to be specifically connected to some arcane devices way older than the queens themselves built be people we know nothing about and who, for instance, left a mirror network behind them.
> 
> It all actually makes you wonder, what actually made the sacred vow made by Embi real and is it somehow related to all that ancient tech?


In the print novels, this entity is described as being a "devil queen". (The strip proper doesn't say anything about who he made the vow to.) If we do visit Embi's homeland, I predict that she's be, yes, another Queen, and Agatha and Co. will use her Mirror to reach Skifander.

----------


## slayerx

> Am i the only one who just seriously disliked the introduction of Queens at all?
> They removes even the pretense that its Mad Science, and not just sufficiently advanced magic.


I would say that at the very least, the queens have been overplayed and have very much LONG overstayed their welcome. Its actually why I am very eager to move on from this arc.

Honestly i find them rather boring compared to sparks. Part of what made sparks interesting was the quirks of their creations and the kind of mad ideas they come up with to solve their problems. Its a lot more fun to watch a spark warp the equipment and tools they have on hand to solve a problem, than to see a queen snap their fingers and have what they need pop out of thin air

----------


## TeChameleon

I'm meh-to-iffy on the whole Queen thing, but the lovely immortal ruler thing draws from the same pulpy roots as gaslamp fantasy-style mad science- H. Rider Haggard's She Who Must Be Obeyed being the obvious example.  It seems to me that the Queens are the Foglios attempt to integrate the two tropes (mad science and lovely-immortal-etc.), and I respect the effort, even if I'm not sure I agree with the final product.

I suspect that we'll be clear of Albia relatively soon (nothing concrete, this just feels like we're closing in on a chapter break), and it doesn't sound like there's a lot of other Queens left; whether it's simply from Lucrezia cleaning house, or a 'the time of the elves is ending'-type fading, we're not likely to be up to our earlobes in Queens any time soon.  We already know, courtesy of the time window, that Agatha doesn't ascend any time soon- note the absence of the starry crown, or whatever you want to call the crap orbiting Albia's head- and that there's some significant chunks of story to get through before we get to the time window.

So hopefully we'll get back to the more standard-level mad science shenanigans in short order.

----------


## smuchmuch

I'll be honnest, I was kind of hoping Albia was going to die here. Either by Lucrezia hand or by a backstabb from Monohan after she defeat Lucrezia, that would have made this whole queen fight a build up for a good payoff rather a pretty flat atempt to a climax that lasted too long and would have made it feel like, well, our heroes can screw up, reestablished Lucrezia as a true threat... shaked up the status quo.. something of the sort. 
...I suppose that would have been a bit too close to what happened with the master of Paris in the Paris arc tho. 

Bah at least this arc is nearing it's conclusion so we can move to the next bit, likely the road to Skyfander in some way, likely by Africa. Plus maybe a look of what is happening in Europa with Gil and Tarvek.




> Am i the only one who just seriously disliked the introduction of Queens at all?
> They removes even the pretense that its Mad Science, and not just sufficiently advanced magic.


That pretense had flown away a long time ago...
Honnestly it's not like the fact that spark is effectively reality alteration wasn't already introduced way back in der castle when Agatha started ascending after drinking some of the Dyne river. And Albia being an immortal in some shape of form god queen had been mentioned since a long long time (when Gil threatened Woodster to boil England, if memory serves he mentions her "undying majesty" and then later it was mentioned than no british citizen could even *think* of betraying Albia. Although seeing this arc, kinda have to wonder how that that was ever taken seriously...)

(Iddle thoughts: Would that have made Lord snackleford after his ascension a "king" or "Lord" or whatever title would that be (maybe just Queen used for both gender...) was he something else entirely ? He didn't have a flamme per se since he was getting his "ascension" from an extra dimensional gate instead.)




> Also i feel like Albia is channeling my feelings on this Arc... very tired and desperately in need of a break.


Frankly, kind of my feeling for ALL of the the ending segments of every arc since Agatha set foot in the castle. 
Just look at the very start of the comic and sjut see how fast thing went then compared to the more recent arcs and books. The reason for that is very likely that the storry has hugely balooned in both length and complexity from what it was originaly planned and now they must also pad each arc so it will fit the number of pages for a book. Which is fair and make sense to what the story is now but... well each arcs feels likethey oversty their welcome just a little too long. prim example being, the endless fight for Mecanisburg, the fight against the Beast taking jsut too long and this queen fight...

----------


## TeChameleon

This is mostly by nature of an aside, but is it just me, or does Albia seem to be showboating a little?  I'm not sure who she's trying to impress, but it looks to me like she's being more dramatic than is strictly necessary with her little flourishes.  Maybe Monahan?  'See what you could do if you were to finish ascending (and keep me company).'  Albia certainly gives the impression of being desperately lonely.

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## geoduck

> This is mostly by nature of an aside, but is it just me, or does Albia seem to be showboating a little?  I'm not sure who she's trying to impress, but it looks to me like she's being more dramatic than is strictly necessary with her little flourishes.  Maybe Monahan?  'See what you could do if you were to finish ascending (and keep me company).'  Albia certainly gives the impression of being desperately lonely.


And maybe trying to bounce back from the fact that Lucrezia came very close to killing her.

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## Shining Wrath

I do think Albia is showing off.
Having said that, even when you know she's about to make an entrance, she makes quite an entrance.
I think she's exhausted, though, and vulnerable. NOW may be when Monahan attempts backstab - once she's safely on her way to England, well, why not arrive as the new Queen?

This is also an example of why Queens are no fun compared to Sparks. How much work would Agatha have needed to do to get the airship moving again? But god-Queen Albia just says "I want a ride home fit for a Queen" and presto chango, there you have it.

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## wingnutx

This is getting old.

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## smuchmuch

> I do think Albia is showing off.
>  How much work would Agatha have needed to do to get the airship moving again?


About two pannels and one minor time skip ? Or half a dozen pages. Or an entire issue. It's not like Agatha skills arehn'gt as good as the plot demand.
And by the end the airship wlould be sentient. And make the best damn coffee.

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## geoduck

> I do think Albia is showing off.
> Having said that, even when you know she's about to make an entrance, she makes quite an entrance.
> I think she's exhausted, though, and vulnerable. NOW may be when Monahan attempts backstab - once she's safely on her way to England, well, why not arrive as the new Queen?


We've never seen any indication that Monahan _wants_ to be Queen of England. I still expect Albia to die at some point, but I doubt it will be Monahan who does it, at least not yet.

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## Ibrinar

I have to say I am not a fan of the queen concept either, if it was tech themed magic that would be one thing. Maybe act as potent energy source for tech, remote control it without remote control, telekinetically manipulated tools, seeing the insides of machines without opening them.  I dunno something that makes them super powered sparks instead a full change to mage. (If they have to be magic.)  But just zapping an airship and it looks different is too far on the magical side for me because I find it less fun than mad science

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## Shining Wrath

It occurs to me that (loosely, I admit holes can be poked in this) queen:spark::lich:wizard. Yeah, you're immortal and you've got even more power, but there's some trade-off involved. Quite possibly, given Snakleford's adventures, both involve deals with Outside Forces of some sort. A lich may well bargain with devils; a queen, with something along the lines of Yog-Sothoth.

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## Traab

> I have to say I am not a fan of the queen concept either, if it was tech themed magic that would be one thing. Maybe act as potent energy source for tech, remote control it without remote control, telekinetically manipulated tools, seeing the insides of machines without opening them.  I dunno something that makes them super powered sparks instead a full change to mage. (If they have to be magic.)  But just zapping an airship and it looks different is too far on the magical side for me because I find it less fun than mad science


It seems to take the whole matter/reality manipulation of being a spark and crank it up another notch. Sparks take something normal and they "improve" it in a way that not only is absurd, but is often unreplicable by anyone else, even other sparks. They might be able to come close, but as we saw with the baron, everything they do leaves a unique fingerprint that cant be copied. These objects do not tend to obey the laws of science in various ways large and small. Agathas coffee machine being the easy target, there is no way any amount of copper tubing is going to turn a coffee maker into a religious experience. What queens do is one step beyond that. Rather than physically build something, they just rearrange matter into whatever they were after. It makes less logical sense than building it by hand, but not that much because built with their brain or their hands the end result is the same, something impossible happens.

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## Shining Wrath

> It seems to take the whole matter/reality manipulation of being a spark and crank it up another notch. Sparks take something normal and they "improve" it in a way that not only is absurd, but is often unreplicable by anyone else, even other sparks. They might be able to come close, but as we saw with the baron, everything they do leaves a unique fingerprint that cant be copied. These objects do not tend to obey the laws of science in various ways large and small. Agathas coffee machine being the easy target, there is no way any amount of copper tubing is going to turn a coffee maker into a religious experience. What queens do is one step beyond that. Rather than physically build something, they just rearrange matter into whatever they were after. It makes less logical sense than building it by hand, but not that much because built with their brain or their hands the end result is the same, something impossible happens.


And beyond even the power of Queens, perhaps, is the power of Kjarl, friend of smeerps. He fixed Vapnoodle with a touch. We don't know what else he could do if he thought it necessary. I am wondering if we're going to find that all Sparky / Queenly power ultimately traces back to an extradimensional source, of which Flames are a manifestation - power leaking into our dimension. And Kjarl lives / lived / will be living there.

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## Mechalich

> It seems to take the whole matter/reality manipulation of being a spark and crank it up another notch. Sparks take something normal and they "improve" it in a way that not only is absurd, but is often unreplicable by anyone else, even other sparks. They might be able to come close, but as we saw with the baron, everything they do leaves a unique fingerprint that cant be copied. These objects do not tend to obey the laws of science in various ways large and small. Agathas coffee machine being the easy target, there is no way any amount of copper tubing is going to turn a coffee maker into a religious experience. What queens do is one step beyond that. Rather than physically build something, they just rearrange matter into whatever they were after. It makes less logical sense than building it by hand, but not that much because built with their brain or their hands the end result is the same, something impossible happens.


Along this line, I think it's more a matter of scale. The average Spark is able to manipulate physical processes at the scale of everyday human interactions, which means the scale at which Newtonian Mechanics holds true and various other macro-processes operate. Queens, by contrast, are able to operate at the atomic realm and manipulate quantum interactions. For example, I wouldn't be surprised if the various size changes Albia and other Queens conduct is based on some sort of Ant-Man style alteration of 'atomic relative distance.' At the same time the energy required for these manipulations also increases as the operational scale decreases. Ordinary Sparks can get by with heat, electricity, and even manual labor in many cases, but Queens require an extradimensional power source. When Agatha briefly 'Queened-up' during the resurrection sequence the key breakthrough wasn't that she did something she didn't know how to do - they'd already planned the process - but that she tapped into a source of energy previously unimagined.

Hypothetically, if someone in Europa were to invent nuclear power that might enable the emergence of Queens without access to extradimensional power sources.

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## Traab

> Along this line, I think it's more a matter of scale. The average Spark is able to manipulate physical processes at the scale of everyday human interactions, which means the scale at which Newtonian Mechanics holds true and various other macro-processes operate. Queens, by contrast, are able to operate at the atomic realm and manipulate quantum interactions. For example, I wouldn't be surprised if the various size changes Albia and other Queens conduct is based on some sort of Ant-Man style alteration of 'atomic relative distance.' At the same time the energy required for these manipulations also increases as the operational scale decreases. Ordinary Sparks can get by with heat, electricity, and even manual labor in many cases, but Queens require an extradimensional power source. When Agatha briefly 'Queened-up' during the resurrection sequence the key breakthrough wasn't that she did something she didn't know how to do - they'd already planned the process - but that she tapped into a source of energy previously unimagined.
> 
> Hypothetically, if someone in Europa were to invent nuclear power that might enable the emergence of Queens without access to extradimensional power sources.


I mean, nuclear power is just steam power basically, using a different fuel source. Its not some sort of mystical energy source that produces power in ways not understood by mortal science. In fact, its only a little different than how der kestle runs. It generates its power through a waterwheel turbine that powers the structure and also gradually charges up its vast banks of dyne filled batteries for use in more... strenuous moments.

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## Mechalich

> I mean, nuclear power is just steam power basically, using a different fuel source. Its not some sort of mystical energy source that produces power in ways not understood by mortal science. In fact, its only a little different than how der kestle runs. It generates its power through a waterwheel turbine that powers the structure and also gradually charges up its vast banks of dyne filled batteries for use in more... strenuous moments.


Nuclear power is significantly more _compact_ than other fuel sources such as coal, oil, or hydroelectric power generation. Castle Heterodyne is able to run off hydropower because it is a lifeform whose volume can be measured using cubic kilometers. A human would presumably struggle with such an accommodation. It is entirely possible to build a nuclear reactor roughly the size of the monster Snackleford summoned that would have output vastly in excess, and for a much longer period, than an equivalently sized diesel generator. For the purpose of creating and sustaining Queens I imagine something like an aircraft carrier nuclear reactor would be ideal.

----------


## Palanan

Are those _warp nacelles_ on an airship?

They read a lot like the nacelles on the original 1701.

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## InvisibleBison

> Nuclear power is significantly more _compact_ than other fuel sources such as coal, oil, or hydroelectric power generation. Castle Heterodyne is able to run off hydropower because it is a lifeform whose volume can be measured using cubic kilometers. A human would presumably struggle with such an accommodation. It is entirely possible to build a nuclear reactor roughly the size of the monster Snackleford summoned that would have output vastly in excess, and for a much longer period, than an equivalently sized diesel generator. For the purpose of creating and sustaining Queens I imagine something like an aircraft carrier nuclear reactor would be ideal.


I don't think an aircraft carrier reactor would be nearly enough to mimic what we see queens do. Let's take Snackleford zapping his followers as an example, since it's fairly easy to estimate the power output. I count sixteen people being struck by what looks like lightning. A single lightning bolt releases a gigajoule of energy, so that's 16 GJ that Snackleford is throwing around - and since power is energy over time, and he unleashes those blasts in a fraction of a second, I'd say he's got at least 160 GW at his disposal. The A1B reactor, which I believe is the most powerful carrier reactor in the world, only outputs about 400 MW, several orders of magnitude less than what Snackleford demonstrates.

----------


## Mechalich

> I don't think an aircraft carrier reactor would be nearly enough to mimic what we see queens do. Let's take Snackleford zapping his followers as an example, since it's fairly easy to estimate the power output. I count sixteen people being struck by what looks like lightning. A single lightning bolt releases a gigajoule of energy, so that's 16 GJ that Snackleford is throwing around - and since power is energy over time, and he unleashes those blasts in a fraction of a second, I'd say he's got at least 160 GW at his disposal. The A1B reactor, which I believe is the most powerful carrier reactor in the world, only outputs about 400 MW, several orders of magnitude less than what Snackleford demonstrates.


Large visible sparks are not necessarily lightning, or in fact anything even close to the actual power of a lightning bolt. Ever seen a large Tesla Coil or Van de Graaf Generator in action? Those are more than capable of throwing out death-dealing sparks at a level of power only a minute fraction of atmospheric lightning.

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## InvisibleBison

Ok, depending on what actually is going on with the zapping a nuclear reactor might be able to handle it. But what about the physical transformation Snackleford undergoes? His legs turn into a bunch of floating rectangles, his hair turns into fire, and he grows four arms. Do you have some reason to think that would require less than 400 MW?

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## Thomas Cardew

> I mean, nuclear power is just steam power basically, using a different fuel source. Its not some sort of mystical energy source that produces power in ways not understood by mortal science. In fact, its only a little different than how der kestle runs. It generates its power through a waterwheel turbine that powers the structure and also gradually charges up its vast banks of dyne filled batteries for use in more... strenuous moments.


That's currently how we use nuclear power. But nuclear power is well... nuclear. And electrical. The fission reaction comes form the strong and weak forces resulting in an unstable nucleus which then blows apart. Then you get massive charged fission products which carry most of the energy away kinetically. In current reactors, all this energy gets dumped into the surrounding fuel as heat. But imagine if you could just transmit the energy of those charged particles directly into electrical power; something that's well within science fiction to imagine/hand-wave. You get a a reactor which harvests energy directly from the motion of the charged particles. No more steam, no more 30% eff power generation, significantly less heat, and cooling requirements. (Same thing with fusion except the forces want to the force the atoms to together, but you still get out a charged nucleus but more of the energy can be carried away by neutral particles) Or introduce a material with super high Seebeck coefficient. 

Reactors only burn a fraction of the fuel and you can design them to run at whatever power level you want assuming you can keep it from thermally dissembling itself. If you can solve the thermal problem by taking the energy out directly as electricity, you could build significantly more powerful reactors without needing more fuel/ space. None of this lets you rapidly shape change or doing any of the other SCIENCE! stuff, but with a relatively small but major technical advancement/ handwave you can generate a LOT more energy in a tiny space.

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## Drogorn

> That's currently how we use nuclear power. But nuclear power is well... nuclear. And electrical. The fission reaction comes form the strong and weak forces resulting in an unstable nucleus which then blows apart. Then you get massive charged fission products which carry most of the energy away kinetically. In current reactors, all this energy gets dumped into the surrounding fuel as heat. But imagine if you could just transmit the energy of those charged particles directly into electrical power; something that's well within science fiction to imagine/hand-wave. You get a a reactor which harvests energy directly from the motion of the charged particles. No more steam, no more 30% eff power generation, significantly less heat, and cooling requirements. (Same thing with fusion except the forces want to the force the atoms to together, but you still get out a charged nucleus but more of the energy can be carried away by neutral particles) Or introduce a material with super high Seebeck coefficient. 
> 
> Reactors only burn a fraction of the fuel and you can design them to run at whatever power level you want assuming you can keep it from thermally dissembling itself. If you can solve the thermal problem by taking the energy out directly as electricity, you could build significantly more powerful reactors without needing more fuel/ space. None of this lets you rapidly shape change or doing any of the other SCIENCE! stuff, but with a relatively small but major technical advancement/ handwave you can generate a LOT more energy in a tiny space.


You might like to know your idea needs no handwave: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fission_fragment_reactor

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## Shining Wrath

Albia really is at the end of her rope.
Also, no clothes may mean that Albia's outfits are always a glamor rather than being material things that she's changing with her.
That is, every time we've seen Albia, she's actually been naked. Look for the R rated GG books to come out in a few years.  :Small Big Grin:  But I wonder if some characters, e.g., Kjarl, see through the glamor.
Agatha is learning some stuff about Queens, and I'll repeat myself: she's going to turn down the chance to ascend, because the price of the power is too high.

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## Scarlet Knight

> That is, every time we've seen Albia, she's actually been naked. Look for the R rated GG books to come out in a few years.  But I wonder if some characters, e.g., Kjarl, see through the glamor.


R rated GG? I'm already looking for the X rated XXXenophile - Girl Genius edition.

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## runeghost

Regarding the discussion vis a vis Queens and Sparkyness... I expect this is why Kaja and Phil have always been adamant that GG is 'gaslamp fantasy' and not 'steampunk'. As the creators, they've always known that the Spark was technology-flavored magic and not just alternate technology paths, even allowing for comic exaggeration. (And there have been a lot of hints over the years, from how there have been Sparky warlords seemingly since the stone age, to an increasing amounts of utterly fantastic stuff like Dreen, the Train and battling the Storm King.)

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## Shining Wrath

> R rated GG? I'm already looking for the X rated XXXenophile - Girl Genius edition.


Well, we haven't had any sex scenes per se, so I don't know if it could be rated X. Going forward, though...

EDIT:

Albia looks completely washed out - grey hair, grey skin. Is that a function of being Flame-energy low? Is she naturally that color now at all times, unless glamored? Monahan doesn't look that way.
Is she really old and staving off death only by her magic?

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## Thomas Cardew

> You might like to know your idea needs no handwave: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fission_fragment_reactor


The handwavey part comes from doing it in solids, or rather at high densities. And doing it with sufficient ease, just like fusion! is the handwaved solution to a lot of energy needs. Sure everything works in theory, but we haven't actually engineered working products yet. Thanks for the link though! I hadn't seen the rocket engine idea. The concepts I'd seen floated were critical gas reactors which just seem like a safety nightmare.

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## Divayth Fyr

> Is she really old and staving off death only by her magic?


The first bit is obviously true - as we could hear, Lu killed off the Queens nearly 5000 years ago. And that Albia's memories go back before the Channel, which would easily put a millenium or two on top of that.

So she is impossibly old, and the queenhood is the only thing we know of so far that would be staving off her death. Immortality does seem to be a trait the Queens shared (note the second panel)

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## Traab

Its really now that we see just how freaking identical monohan looks to agatha. She is even wearing what looks almost exactly like one of agathas outfits. And this was an interesting twist. I think albia is going to be a bit more indebted to agatha over this. She now knows albia is in a bad spot and helped her to cover for it. She didnt move to take advantage, backstab, control, whatever, she helped. Thats brownie points right there with a rational ruler. Which albia (mostly) is. And its understandable, Albia rules by being so much larger than life that even if you arent mind controlled you wouldnt even think to oppose her because of how flamboyantly powerful she is. Had they seen her grey and near passed out lying on the floor, that could have caused massive damage to her prestige should word get out that she actually CAN be exhausted. Im guessing she is a lot like the master right now, sustained by her flames alone, (as he was by his cyborg suit) and basically on life support while bluffing the world that she is as overwhelming as she has been for centuries now.

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## Shining Wrath

> Its really now that we see just how freaking identical monohan looks to agatha. She is even wearing what looks almost exactly like one of agathas outfits. And this was an interesting twist. I think albia is going to be a bit more indebted to agatha over this. She now knows albia is in a bad spot and helped her to cover for it. She didnt move to take advantage, backstab, control, whatever, she helped. Thats brownie points right there with a rational ruler. Which albia (mostly) is. And its understandable, Albia rules by being so much larger than life that even if you arent mind controlled you wouldnt even think to oppose her because of how flamboyantly powerful she is. Had they seen her grey and near passed out lying on the floor, that could have caused massive damage to her prestige should word get out that she actually CAN be exhausted. Im guessing she is a lot like the master right now, sustained by her flames alone, (as he was by his cyborg suit) and basically on life support while bluffing the world that she is as overwhelming as she has been for centuries now.


Has she *always* (since ascension) been sustained only by the Flame? Is that the bargain - you are immensely powerful so long as you can tap into your power source, but underneath the glamors you are close to dead? Again, is a Queen sorta lich-like?

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## Divayth Fyr

> Has she *always* (since ascension) been sustained only by the Flame? Is that the bargain - you are immensely powerful so long as you can tap into your power source, but underneath the glamors you are close to dead? Again, is a Queen sorta lich-like?


The answer is: we can't be 100% sure due to the lack of available information. I'd find it more likely that you're immensly powerful as long as you can tap into the power source and you can use that power to extend your life. Otherwise you'll die at the time you would otherwise.

Obviously with several millenia under her belt, Albia is way past that point.

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## Drogorn

> The handwavey part comes from doing it in solids, or rather at high densities. And doing it with sufficient ease, just like fusion! is the handwaved solution to a lot of energy needs. Sure everything works in theory, but we haven't actually engineered working products yet. Thanks for the link though! I hadn't seen the rocket engine idea. The concepts I'd seen floated were critical gas reactors which just seem like a safety nightmare.


If you like that, then you're bound to like this: http://www.projectrho.com/public_htm...ngineintro.php

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## Traab

> The answer is: we can't be 100% sure due to the lack of available information. I'd find it more likely that you're immensly powerful as long as you can tap into the power source and you can use that power to extend your life. Otherwise you'll die at the time you would otherwise.
> 
> Obviously with several millenia under her belt, Albia is way past that point.


Im guessing that at first you arent really reliant on it for survival. There is no way the queens council visits could happen if everyone had to stay with their flames. I wouldnt be surprised though if it turns out the flames are the source of the extra energy required to do crazy queen stuff and their bodies can only contain so much of it. I further wouldnt be surprised if the older you get, the less you can hold, and the greater the effects are of overdoing things. And possibly you are constantly draining that flame energy to maintain your existence because your body requires more and more to keep you going.

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## Zazu Yen

A glimpse behind the curtain! As others have pointed out Albia's sudden nudity when her power ebbs brings into question just how much of what we've seen from the Queens is glamor or illusions rather than physical manifestations. This new ship must be mostly real (or Bang is going to be _really_ upset) but most of the actual flash is mere illusionary set-dressing, which Lunevka was constantly alluding to until her (finally) demise. 

This also has made me reconsider Colette Voltaire's clank Queen. Pretending to be a Queen might be handy in scaring off possible threats to Paris, but it could also be a clever trap to try and expose and possibly neutralize a Lucrezia.

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## Shining Wrath

> The first bit is obviously true - as we could hear, Lu killed off the Queens nearly 5000 years ago. And that Albia's memories go back before the Channel, which would easily put a millenium or two on top of that.
> 
> So she is impossibly old, and the queenhood is the only thing we know of so far that would be staving off her death. Immortality does seem to be a trait the Queens shared (note the second panel)


Worth a note from the first comic - the "Mirrors went dark" and it took Albia years to make her way home from wherever she was thrown. So a Queen is not tied to their flame, or at least the young Albia was capable of wandering Flameless for years.

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## Sean Mirrsen

> Worth a note from the first comic - the "Mirrors went dark" and it took Albia years to make her way home from wherever she was thrown. So a Queen is not tied to their flame, or at least the young Albia was capable of wandering Flameless for years.


I think the Queen is a vessel for the power, so to speak. The Flame sustains her, but she doesn't pull the power directly from the Flame - her body has to process and contain it first. So if Albia went Flameless, she would just operate on the stored power, and could go for a long time if she avoided flashy outbursts. Here, though, Albia went away from her flame and immediately went overdrive, bursting in with massive size and everything. She also lost almost all of it immediately when she got blasted by the Queen-killer deathray, and was forced to shrink down and conserve what she still had. So now, she's on the last fumes of her Flame, while still needing to keep up her majestic appearances. Her power vessel is spent, and thus she slipped into her 'real' form after teleporting - which is also a flashy, energy-intensive thing, but a Queen does not climb a rope ladder to get in.

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## Shining Wrath

> I think the Queen is a vessel for the power, so to speak. The Flame sustains her, but she doesn't pull the power directly from the Flame - her body has to process and contain it first. So if Albia went Flameless, she would just operate on the stored power, and could go for a long time if she avoided flashy outbursts. Here, though, Albia went away from her flame and immediately went overdrive, bursting in with massive size and everything. She also lost almost all of it immediately when she got blasted by the Queen-killer deathray, and was forced to shrink down and conserve what she still had. So now, she's on the last fumes of her Flame, while still needing to keep up her majestic appearances. Her power vessel is spent, and thus she slipped into her 'real' form after teleporting - which is also a flashy, energy-intensive thing, but a Queen does not climb a rope ladder to get in.


She seems to recover power with a brief rest, though. And why, when at the end of her power, did she go for such a flashy vessel? Is she so fixated on appearances? Or so desperately needing to keep up the façade in order to keep the peace?

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## wingnutx

> Worth a note from the first comic - the "Mirrors went dark" and it took Albia years to make her way home from wherever she was thrown. So a Queen is not tied to their flame, or at least the young Albia was capable of wandering Flameless for years.


I think that was a difficult journey with vastly lessened power at her disposal.

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## Divayth Fyr

> She seems to recover power with a brief rest, though. And why, when at the end of her power, did she go for such a flashy vessel? Is she so fixated on appearances? Or so desperately needing to keep up the façade in order to keep the peace?


Probably the latter - as far as we know, nothing suggested she was on the decline before the current events and we still had Snackleford and Moonbark with their conspiracies. If she showed weakness, it probably wouldn't be a handful of occurences, but dozens. Probably with many more cases of openly going against the Queen - cause that is how Sparks roll...

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## Shining Wrath

> Probably the latter - as far as we know, nothing suggested she was on the decline before the current events and we still had Snackleford and Moonbark with their conspiracies. If she showed weakness, it probably wouldn't be a handful of occurences, but dozens. Probably with many more cases of openly going against the Queen - cause that is how Sparks roll...


So wait until her Flame is at full power, charge up, feign weakness, squash many uppity Sparks who think they can challenge her, profit?

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## PoeticallyPsyco

> So wait until her Flame is at full power, charge up, feign weakness, squash many uppity Sparks who think they can challenge her, profit?


That would only work if uppity sparks weren't a limitless resource.

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## Sean Mirrsen

> She seems to recover power with a brief rest, though. And why, when at the end of her power, did she go for such a flashy vessel? Is she so fixated on appearances? Or so desperately needing to keep up the façade in order to keep the peace?


I think it's equal parts option two, and option three. Option three being "she's dangerously low on power and might be very useless when it comes to protecting anyone for a while, so she's going to rely on the ship, and the ship has to be big, fast, and sufficiently powerful to both protect her and serve her other purposes".

The exact details of the ship might also not matter. Like when you fire up a Star Trek style replicator, you probably need the same amount of energy for creating a solid block of iron, and a laptop of the same mass. Depending on how her powers work it simply might be a matter of "as long as I'm doing this anyway, it costs me little to make it flashy".

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## Radar

> So wait until her Flame is at full power, charge up, feign weakness, squash many uppity Sparks who think they can challenge her, profit?


That would still be showing that you *do* have a weakness. Not exactly a good move.

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## Divayth Fyr

> That would still be showing that you *do* have a weakness. Not exactly a good move.


Yeah - keeping up the appearance of power all the time means people have little reason to doubt it. Show weakness even once, even claiming later to be a feign, and people will start doubting.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Albia really is lonely and wants Monahan as a friend. She's coaching her in the ways of Queendom.

And will the rats start a fight?

----------


## Rakaydos

> Albia really is lonely and wants Monahan as a friend. She's coaching her in the ways of Queendom.
> 
> And will the rats start a fight?


No, because God-queen Albina will walk Monahan through pacifying them, while playing it as tutorage and not being too weak to shake a kitten at the rats right now.

(lift a kitten, shake a stick, set a cat upon the rats...)

----------


## Traab

Albia really needs to be left alone for a bit, I get the feeling that she is basically clenching as hard as she can to not show weakness, I expect agatha to try and chivvy everyone out the door asap.

----------


## theangelJean

Maybe Albia doesn't see Monahan as a threat because she thinks Monahan wants only rats as her subjects?

----------


## TeChameleon

Honestly?  I'm still thinking that Albia is lonely- enough so that it might even be affecting her judgement.

Also, love that Agatha managed to end up sitting astride one of the rats.  There's that protagonist energy right there.

----------


## Mechalich

Albia may also be banking on the queen-subject relationship here. Monahan is English, and like the rest of the English in this universe has lived her life regarding Albia as a living god. And she's already charged forth at great risk to save Albia when she could have simply run. In the most recent comic Monahan instinctively subordinates herself to Albia's instructions.

Also, Monahan is now Lucrezia's enemy too, and both Monahan and Albia know this (even though, ironically, Lucrezia doesn't know it yet). She's a very significant enemy too (probably #5 on the list, behind Agatha, Albia, Gil, and Zola). It is very much in the interest of them both to stand together until Lucrezia is dealt with.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> Honestly?  I'm still thinking that Albia is lonely- enough so that it might even be affecting her judgement.
> 
> Also, love that Agatha managed to end up sitting astride one of the rats.  There's that protagonist energy right there.


And Hadrian is giving Neena a little support. What a gentleman!





> Albia may also be banking on the queen-subject relationship here. Monahan is English, and like the rest of the English in this universe has lived her life regarding Albia as a living god. And she's already charged forth at great risk to save Albia when she could have simply run. In the most recent comic Monahan instinctively subordinates herself to Albia's instructions.
> 
> Also, Monahan is now Lucrezia's enemy too, and both Monahan and Albia know this (even though, ironically, Lucrezia doesn't know it yet). She's a very significant enemy too (probably #5 on the list, behind Agatha, Albia, Gil, and Zola). It is very much in the interest of them both to stand together until Lucrezia is dealt with.


Plus, Albia knows how to be a queen, and Monahan doesn't. Albia has already pointed out that whatever Lucrezia has become, it isn't anywhere near being a queen, and I don't think Monahan expected queen lessons from Lucrezia either.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> Monahan is English


Is she? True, she lived and worked in England for some time, but her name and appearance makes me think she's Irish by ancestry. Do we know whether or not Ireland is under English rule? Alternatively, has Monahan ever actually been identified as English in the comic?

----------


## Rodin

> Is she? True, she lived and worked in England for some time, but her name and appearance makes me think she's Irish by ancestry. Do we know whether or not Ireland is under English rule? Alternatively, has Monahan ever actually been identified as English in the comic?


I would be surprised if Ireland is independent, even assuming the island is still above water and didn't get sunk.  Ireland in the real world didn't gain independence until the 20th century, and GGverse has the added power of a Godqueen to ensure Ireland remained under Albia's rule.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> I would be surprised if Ireland is independent, even assuming the island is still above water and didn't get sunk.  Ireland in the real world didn't gain independence until the 20th century, and GGverse has the added power of a Godqueen to ensure Ireland remained under Albia's rule.


On the other hand, Ireland fell under English rule due to various historical events that Albia would have necessarily prevented from occurring. On the gripping hand, GG England bears a close resemblance to 19th century Britain (or at least a general perception thereof) regardless of the dramatic differences in history, so who knows.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> I would be surprised if Ireland is independent, even assuming the island is still above water and didn't get sunk.  Ireland in the real world didn't gain independence until the 20th century, and GGverse has the added power of a Godqueen to ensure Ireland remained under Albia's rule.


Bits of Ireland are still above water, according to this (admittedly not confirmed as cannonical) map.

Depending on where the border is, it looks like a fair chunk of Eire is gone, and there 'ain't much left of Northern Ireland (the modern UK bit) left either. Unlike the English and Welsh bits it looks like the missing land hasn't been replaced by "England Deep Glass City" either.

----------


## Gez

We have seen that the flag of Albia's kingdom is just like the regular Union Jack we're all familiar with. But the reason why that Union Jack is the _Union_ Jack is because it's an overlay of Saint George's Cross (red +, England), Saint Andrew's Cross (blue x, Scotland, but with colors interchanged), and Saint Patrick's Cross (red x, Ireland). Therefore, we can presume Ireland is part of Albia's domain in GGverse too.

----------


## Fyraltari

> We have seen that the flag of Albia's kingdom is just like the regular Union Jack we're all familiar with. But the reason why that Union Jack is the _Union_ Jack is because it's an overlay of Saint George's Cross (red +, England), Saint Andrew's Cross (blue x, Scotland, but with colors interchanged), and Saint Patrick's Cross (red x, Ireland). Therefore, we can presume Ireland is part of Albia's domain in GGverse too.


Okay, but by the same token, Albia is consistently called "the Queen of England" not "Queen of the United Kingdom (of Great Britain and Northern Ireland)" which is the actual real-life title. So I wouldn't put too much stock in the flag.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I'm going to go with "What's left of Ireland and Scotland isn't big enough to matter in terms of Albia's title", although admittedly modern British would probably call themselves the United Kingdom if all that was left was Trafalgar Square.

Anyway, when Albia showed up she was not hostile toward Monahan. Monahan knows this. Whatever territory Monahan claims, it will be near but not within Albia's territory.

----------


## DaFlipp

Man, for some reason I just... really like the simple kindness from Agatha in this strip. 

Everyone else is so caught up in the adrenaline of the moment and the afterglow of battle that they can't even notice that their rescuer is barely holding it together, but Agatha does. And so, with a fairly reasonable suggestion (hell, *absurdly* reasonable by spark standards!), she's able to clear the room and give Queen Albia (who clearly feels she cannot afford to show any more weakness in front of her people) a chance to catch her breath. 

I'm not saying it's a particularly over-the-top show of goodness or anything, but it's just a nice reminder that, among all the anti-heroes, gung-ho murderers, and straight-up sociopaths that roam this universe, there's at least one power player who's willing to just... be nice, when the situation allows her to be.

----------


## geoduck

> Man, for some reason I just... really like the simple kindness from Agatha in this strip. 
> 
> Everyone else is so caught up in the adrenaline of the moment and the afterglow of battle that they can't even notice that their rescuer is barely holding it together, but Agatha does. And so, with a fairly reasonable suggestion (hell, *absurdly* reasonable by spark standards!), she's able to clear the room and give Queen Albia (who clearly feels she cannot afford to show any more weakness in front of her people) a chance to catch her breath. 
> 
> I'm not saying it's a particularly over-the-top show of goodness or anything, but it's just a nice reminder that, among all the anti-heroes, gung-ho murderers, and straight-up sociopaths that roam this universe, there's at least one power player who's willing to just... be nice, when the situation allows her to be.


Along with being nice, it's good politics, having Albia show weakness right now would be really bad.

----------


## factotum

> Okay, but by the same token, Albia is consistently called "the Queen of England" not "Queen of the United Kingdom (of Great Britain and Northern Ireland)" which is the actual real-life title. So I wouldn't put too much stock in the flag.


Given the strip is written by an American and they *always* make the mistake of confusing England with the UK, I wouldn't put too much stock on what Albia is called, either!

----------


## theangelJean

> with a fairly reasonable suggestion (hell, *absurdly* reasonable by spark standards!)


So much this. Agatha was clearly reaching for an excuse, but in the end she found it in common-people behaviour, which is somewhere many Sparks and aristocrats probably have never been. Minions hungry? Someone else's minions? Agatha is showing her non-spark upbringing. 

And while non-sparks can apparently be as generous or self-serving as anyone else (eg. Moloch's late brother) Agatha was brought up to be a nice person and a Good Girl. She might not be an Anti-Evil Paragon Heterodyne like the Boys, but she knows how to not be evil.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I notice Albia is back to grey again. And her loneliness is confirmed.

I think Albia is sincerely grateful. If she had plans to add Agatha to her garden, I think she will alter them. In fact, she's going to get all the help England can give her to liberate Mechanicsburg.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> We have seen that the flag of Albia's kingdom is just like the regular Union Jack we're all familiar with. But the reason why that Union Jack is the _Union_ Jack is because it's an overlay of Saint George's Cross (red +, England), Saint Andrew's Cross (blue x, Scotland, but with colors interchanged), and Saint Patrick's Cross (red x, Ireland). Therefore, we can presume Ireland is part of Albia's domain in GGverse too.





> Okay, but by the same token, Albia is consistently called "the Queen of England" not "Queen of the United Kingdom (of Great Britain and Northern Ireland)" which is the actual real-life title. So I wouldn't put too much stock in the flag.


The flag has to be recognizable (at a glance, not after a history lesson/reminder). Even if the fantastical country is really just England, I imagine the flag would still be the entire Union Jack.

----------


## Traab

> Given the strip is written by an American and they *always* make the mistake of confusing England with the UK, I wouldn't put too much stock on what Albia is called, either!


Theres a difference? /runs away to hide, whistling yankee doodle. But yeah, albia may be lonely, but she was also desperate to NOT have to fight anymore. Lets see how accommodating she is once she gets to regather her strength. Assuming she can of course. Agatha is really good at being in the area when regime change takes place. I just think thats an aspect that was overlooked in all this. Albia is clearly running on fumes and glamours right now and about to collapse. She doesnt DARE show weakness right now. Its bad enough agatha spotted it and monohan might have suspicions once she gets the chance to sit and think for a bit. So yeah, super helpful, super friendly, please dont try to kill me now when I cant fight back without killing myself.

----------


## theangelJean

I actually wonder if Queens ever suffered from the power struggles that we're assuming are inherent to GG-verse politics. We're assuming Albia sees Agatha and Monahan as threats, but what if she would actually welcome their ascension? The queens in Albia's memories seems to have gotten on well, enough to have conferences with them all in the same place. Could it be that they are above the pettiness of the current ruling houses? 

Or maybe it's just that the one-Queen-one-Flame aspect made it impractical or unforeseeable to have power disputes in ancient times. Monahan is now a Queen running around without a Flame to sustain her. If Albia can get her to use up her power, she may be weakened. 

Also, Albia's flame may be at an ebb, but she has also been called at least twice recently - once with Thorpe's body to act through, and now being forced to manifest on her own. She may be at her weakest right now, but she's not necessarily always like this.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I actually wonder if Queens ever suffered from the power struggles that we're assuming are inherent to GG-verse politics. We're assuming Albia sees Agatha and Monahan as threats, but what if she would actually welcome their ascension? The queens in Albia's memories seems to have gotten on well, enough to have conferences with them all in the same place. Could it be that they are above the pettiness of the current ruling houses? 
> 
> Or maybe it's just that the one-Queen-one-Flame aspect made it impractical or unforeseeable to have power disputes in ancient times. Monahan is now a Queen running around without a Flame to sustain her. If Albia can get her to use up her power, she may be weakened. 
> 
> Also, Albia's flame may be at an ebb, but she has also been called at least twice recently - once with Thorpe's body to act through, and now being forced to manifest on her own. She may be at her weakest right now, but she's not necessarily always like this.


And we have Lucrezia's word that Albia's flame is at it's ebb. I wonder how she knows?

EDIT:

New non-strip. The next events are going to be consequential and they want to ensure they are not breaking continuity. That shows that they do care about that stuff and do think things through, long term.

Is Agatha about to be offered the chance to ascend? Will Albia die because Clankrezia snuck on board disguised as a rat?

----------


## hajo

> New non-strip.


Franz the playful dragon  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Well, he's clearly done some literature (I hope he didn't watch the film), so:

Franz the Read Dragon

(That pre-supposes he shows his work, of course)

----------


## Shining Wrath

Heterodynes cheat. Poor thieves.

This will either be a very short episode, or that thief has an interesting reason for being there - one sufficient to forestall ignition.

----------


## Fyraltari

"Some distant time hence."

Does that mean long before or long after?

----------


## sihnfahl

> "Some distant time hence."
> 
> Does that mean long before or long after?


Long after.

----------


## St Fan

For a thief, I find those checkered pants rather... conspicuous.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> Heterodynes cheat. Poor thieves.
> 
> This will either be a very short episode, or that thief has an interesting reason for being there - one sufficient to forestall ignition.


My thoughts exactly. What if Smaug had been a more complex character, had taken interest in Bilbo's need for the Arkenstone and had gotten involved in dwarf/elf politics? Could be amusing.

In other observations, while going back over Monahan's queening to get a better sense of her nature I came across this reference to Albia's flame from Lunevka "Albia's [flame] should be flaring again soon - maybe I'll take hers!". So it seems Albia just has to hang on until the flare, or that would be the time for a regime change. 

But I don't think Monahan would WANT to be queen of England even if it was offered to her. She's a mad-scientist and a narcissist, but not really a megalomaniac. Having experiments to do and rats to play with is more important to her than having flunkies to order around and subjects who bow to her, or the responsibilities of an entire kingdom thrust upon her.

----------


## Shining Wrath

We're setting up for something so dramatic in terms of plot that the Foglios want an entire mini-series's duration to think things through. It would be dramatically unsatisfying if Albia simply died of exhaustion; I don't think Monahan is a near term enemy; and I'll be tempted to stop reading if Lucrezia shows up AGAIN. I mean, that'd be "horror movie series villain" like Freddy Kruger or Jason level don't-stay-dead. So I don't think Albia's going to die. What could be that level of plot twist? Well, maybe Agatha's going to be offered a chance at Queenhood out of gratitude. Or maybe we're about to switch scenes and find out what Gil and Tarvek are up to, and that's going to be very dramatic indeed (like, return of Zuleena).

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

My guess is that they will fire some Chekhov's Guns add and load up some new ones.

----------


## geoduck

> We're setting up for something so dramatic in terms of plot that the Foglios want an entire mini-series's duration to think things through. It would be dramatically unsatisfying if Albia simply died of exhaustion; I don't think Monahan is a near term enemy; and I'll be tempted to stop reading if Lucrezia shows up AGAIN. I mean, that'd be "horror movie series villain" like Freddy Kruger or Jason level don't-stay-dead. So I don't think Albia's going to die. What could be that level of plot twist? Well, maybe Agatha's going to be offered a chance at Queenhood out of gratitude. Or maybe we're about to switch scenes and find out what Gil and Tarvek are up to, and that's going to be very dramatic indeed (like, return of Zuleena).


Zuleena's return is pretty much assured, she's gotta be the "Steel Shrike" that Twitter-Othar was last seen talking to.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Steel Shrike has also been directly referenced in-comic. It's very probable that she'll make an appearance.

----------


## Shining Wrath

While I'd like to see a wrap-up to England, we may cut back to Europe and Othar / the Shrike. It would be an odd place to leave us hanging, though. Probably we're going to see Albia explain Queens to Monahan and Agatha.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

I am quite happy to see a side story about Herr Franz.

----------


## theangelJean

New comic. 

She does have a good reason! Now to see if it's genuine ... And if it makes a difference.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I like Franz's loupe.
I very much suspect that Other's chronometer will involve time-travel shenanigans, possibly allowing the vault to be looted. Except Franz will triumph and come back in the nick to prevent looting.

----------


## Zazu Yen

... :Small Red Face: ... Othar's chronometer? Are we about to get some solid links between Othar's twitter and main comic? This could be some fallout from their double checking the continuity, realizing they can sprinkle out some more crumbs for those of us, like me, who are a little obsessed with figuring out the timeline(s) while preparing the next big thing. Ooh I hope so. (get's out notebook)

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

Lost Hero?

he wouldnt be trapped inside the chronometer?

----------


## Rodin

> ...... Othar's chronometer? Are we about to get some solid links between Othar's twitter and main comic? This could be some fallout from their double checking the continuity, realizing they can sprinkle out some more crumbs for those of us, like me, who are a little obsessed with figuring out the timeline(s) while preparing the next big thing. Ooh I hope so. (get's out notebook)


It's also a good opportunity to inform a wider audience about what's been going on in Twitterland.  The only reason I know Othar's Twitter exists is this forum, and even so I haven't been reading it.  If those events/characters are likely to become relevant (like the Shrike) they can take this time to tell a side story which brings the Twitter posts into canon.  They set up the next part of the story as they check continuity.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Lost Hero?
> 
> he wouldnt be trapped inside the chronometer?


And he'll pop out, seize some ill-gotten gain of the old Heterodynes, and vanish with a smirk!

----------


## eee

Oh.  A librarian from the Incorruptible Library in search o a lost book.  Fanatical insanity, imminent.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Oh.  A librarian from the Incorruptible Library in search o a lost book.  Fanatical insanity, imminent.


And she wants to _read_ it? Does she have eidetic memory? Is she looking for a clue to the location of some other tome of even greater value? What's the point to a librarian of merely reading a book?

----------


## runeghost

> And she wants to _read_ it? Does she have eidetic memory? Is she looking for a clue to the location of some other tome of even greater value? What's the point to a librarian of merely reading a book?


So they can properly index it in their card catalog? :)

----------


## Traab

> And she wants to _read_ it? Does she have eidetic memory? Is she looking for a clue to the location of some other tome of even greater value? What's the point to a librarian of merely reading a book?


Well OBVIOUSLY its so they can then memory gram print it for their library. While the original would be best, so long as they can get an accurate copy they will be satisfied.

----------


## tyckspoon

> And she wants to _read_ it? Does she have eidetic memory? Is she looking for a clue to the location of some other tome of even greater value? What's the point to a librarian of merely reading a book?


Well, geeze, they're not just gonna steal it. They just want to confirm that the book exists and where it is. If they can verify that it appears to be legitimate they can then turn the case over to the Acquisitions department to negotiate with The Heterodyne to purchase it or get access to copy it (and assuming said Heterodyne happens to still be Agatha, decent chance the price for it is just 'oh, I had no idea we had that. Make me a copy too.')

----------


## Fyraltari

> Well, geeze, they're not just gonna steal it.


You sound very sure about that.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Membership with the Incorruptable Library?

I was nearly right - it's Franz the Well Read Dragon.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Accepting that chronometer of Othar Tryggvassen, *Gentleman Adventurer*, seems like a terrible idea. You have no idea what those hero types would be up to.  :Small Big Grin: 

These Librarians take books really serious.

----------


## Rockphed

I do not think this supposed librarian is on the up-and-up.  Agatha got along well with the library back in Paris.  If this person were actually from the library they would have gone to see Agatha first (unless this is after her passing).  At the least they would have gotten Van (or his replacement) to introduce them properly.  But then they would have created records of their existence and Van probably is smart enough to have just gone and asked Franz for the book while a couple Jaegers kept the interloper contained.

I foresee this ending with Franz chowing down on a freshly roasted interloper.

----------


## eee

Thinking it over, I'm wondering why Franz would respond to a request for a book trade with "CHOW TIME!!"  Maybe he's had bad experiences loaning his books, before.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

> Thinking it over, I'm wondering why Franz would respond to a request for a book trade with "CHOW TIME!!"  Maybe he's had bad experiences loaning his books, before.


He's the guardian dragon of the Heterodyne vault. I guess the only books that would be in his possesion would be too blasphemous or dangerous for the Heterodynes to display in the castle librar.

----------


## Deliverance

A lost work of Masat? Say, that rings a bell. It has only been 11 years:

https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110516

There's seriously potential for a brick joke if it turns out that the Baron told a partial truth rather than lying about everything as it seemed at the time, and Franz got his copy from Gilgamesh.

----------


## geoduck

> A lost work of Masat? Say, that rings a bell. It has only been 11 years:
> 
> https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110516
> 
> There's seriously potential for a brick joke if it turns out that the Baron told a partial truth rather than lying about everything as it seemed at the time, and Franz got his copy from Gilgamesh.


There's also this scene, which may or may not be canon.

----------


## wingnutx

> Thinking it over, I'm wondering why Franz would respond to a request for a book trade with "CHOW TIME!!"  Maybe he's had bad experiences loaning his books, before.


The most valuable things the Heterodynes have are their secrets.

----------


## theangelJean

Well, officially they're not his to loan or give away; he just gives away trinkets he knows the Heterodynes won't miss. If they found out he had given away a book there would be Words. (No pun intended.)

Anyway, she just wants to read it ... Aloud ... To lull him back to sleep.

----------


## MDR

Is 'How I Did It" a tribute to Young Frankenstein??

----------


## Radar

> A lost work of Masat? Say, that rings a bell. It has only been 11 years:
> 
> https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110516
> 
> There's seriously potential for a brick joke if it turns out that the Baron told a partial truth rather than lying about everything as it seemed at the time, and Franz got his copy from Gilgamesh.


And they do reference that brick joke!  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## wingnutx

> Is 'How I Did It" a tribute to Young Frankenstein??


More like O.J. Simpson.

----------


## geoduck

> More like O.J. Simpson.


Maybe you're joking, but no, it's a Young Frankenstein gag, the characters find a book with that specific title written by the original Mad Doctor himself.

----------


## scienceguy8

> Is 'How I Did It" a tribute to Young Frankenstein??


I thought it was a reference to Monkey Island 2: LeChuck's Revenge.

----------


## Grim Portent

I'm getting the impression that the books Franz has aren't the Heterodyne's, they're his.

He's not just a monster after all, he's demonstrated a lot of personality before and it seems reasonable to assume that he keeps some stuff for his own personal use, and reading is a good way to pass the time.

The Friday page has a giant reading nook for him and everything, unless one of the Heterodyne's of old needed a ten foot tall chair.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I'm getting the impression that the books Franz has aren't the Heterodyne's, they're his.
> 
> He's not just a monster after all, he's demonstrated a lot of personality before and it seems reasonable to assume that he keeps some stuff for his own personal use, and reading is a good way to pass the time.
> 
> The Friday page has a giant reading nook for him and everything, unless one of the Heterodyne's of old needed a ten foot tall chair.


And we know he borrowed books from the Incorruptible Library and paid his back fines. And he quotes books when first he detects the librarian. Franz is a present-tense reader.
Also he's read all the books the Heterodynes have locked away as "nope, not even Heterodynes want their kids reading this one". As a dragon, I wonder what he thinks of terrible humans?

----------


## Grim Portent

I think the locked books were sealed by Franz without Heterodyne input, everything in the room is sized for him even if the room itself sits net to a Heterodyne treasure vault. The books and scrolls were presumably copied from more normal sized texts for his use, possibly even by him given the presence of a giant quill.

There's more to our lightning-powered friend than we know. He's ancient, rather amiable under the correct circumstances, and not really malicious by any means. If any of those texts were a threat to any Mechanicsburg kids that might sneak in he'd probably lock them up on his own initiative.



On a side note, can anyone make out the second word in the open book on the lectern? It looks like it says 'Dragon Ha' but I can't make out anything past that. Might be a hidden joke.

----------


## Fyraltari

> As a dragon, I wonder what he thinks of terrible humans?


There's no such thing as a terrible human as long as you cook them right.

----------


## Grim Portent

> There's no such thing as a terrible human as long as you cook them right.


They are much nicer if corn-fed and raised with plenty of access to the outdoors though.

----------


## Laurentio III

> On a side note, can anyone make out the second word in the open book on the lectern? It looks like it says 'Dragon Ha' but I can't make out anything past that. Might be a hidden joke.


It's not a "H", it's the lower part of a flourish "G" in "draGon".
The following part is nonsensical to me. "ou"?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> It's not a "H", it's the lower part of a flourish "G" in "draGon".
> The following part is nonsensical to me. "ou"?


French for "Where"?

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

so Franz has Volume One without realizing that there are sequels.
I sense a trade deal coming up: We get to copy yours in exchange for a copy of ours.

----------


## theangelJean

> so Franz has Volume One without realizing that there are sequels.
> I sense a trade deal coming up: We get to copy yours in exchange for a copy of ours.


I thought they were all lost? "Volume One of the lost works of Masat" doesn't actually imply that any of the rest have been found. Maybe Franz has a new quest?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I thought they were all lost? "Volume One of the lost works of Masat" doesn't actually imply that any of the rest have been found. Maybe Franz has a new quest?


I suspect the nameless librarian is on a quest; reading Volume One she hopes will lead her to Volume Two.

Franz will probably help her.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

Does Franz have a Play-princess calendar?

----------


## Willie the Duck

> Does Franz have a Play-princess calendar?


I would call it a 'Princess Pin-up art' calendar*, but conceptually pretty much the same. Aside from the 'where does he get dragon-sized _____?' questions, this does indicate that he has regular communication with the above world (since he can get a calendar made for this year, etc.).
*I've always seen the Foglios as closer to the 'burlesque and vivacious' side of sexual theming than even Playboy-level tawdry. Also it is literally pinned up on his corkboard.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I note Franz intends to travel to Paris. I assume there will be a temporary guardian for the loot - perhaps a small horde of Jagers?

----------


## eee

Ah, so this is why the idea of taking one of Franz's books lead him to cry "Head chomp tiny bits!"  He is a rabid book collector.

I empathize.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

> I note Franz intends to travel to Paris. I assume there will be a temporary guardian for the loot - perhaps a small horde of Jagers?


I'm pretty sure the only people who want to take loot from the hoard are locals, heroes , and fools. Locals will respect Franz' day off, heroes don't want to loot a hoard without a dragon (thats just common thievery!), and fools get squashed before they can get this far.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I'm pretty sure the only people who want to take loot from the hoard are locals, heroes , and fools. Locals will respect Franz' day off, heroes don't want to loot a hoard without a dragon (thats just common thievery!), and fools get squashed before they can get this far.


The guy who rang the doom bell wanted loot without defeating the dragon ....

----------


## InvisibleBison

> The guy who rang the doom bell wanted loot without defeating the dragon ....


He didn't know there was a dragon - just a "loyal guardian". And he never got into the vault, and there's a pretty strong case to be made that he got squashed, so I think he'd fit into the category of fool.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> I would call it a 'Princess Pin-up art' calendar*, but conceptually pretty much the same. Aside from the 'where does he get dragon-sized _____?' questions...


"Oh, mighty dragon! I, a humble local illustrator, come bearing a gift! A pinup calendar of The Lady Heterodyne's storybook companions, drawn by my own hand (and imagination)! All I crave is a small worthless bauble so I can get in the gang."

"Sure, just sign here and in 2 years if you make the payments..."

"Eeep! Uh how about instead I bring you more calendars every year..."

"Will the naughty bits be drawn in? This one's a tad...tame."

"Why not? Sure!" 

"Done!"

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> He didn't know there was a dragon - just a "loyal guardian". And he never got into the vault, and there's a pretty strong case to be made that he got squashed, so I think he'd fit into the category of fool.


There's no indication that he got squashed (he's slowly recovering from the Doom Bell, and the Castle is in fact preventing Franz from eating him). According to a footnote in the novel (which I am reading at the moment) he goes on to be a loyal Heterodyne minion.

As an aside, also footnoted, and relevent to the "I am *the* Dragon" comment - Franz is believed to be the first dragon, especially by the other dragons.

----------


## Fyraltari

> As an aside, also footnoted, and relevent to the "I am *the* Dragon" comment - Franz is believed to be the first dragon, especially by the other dragons.


How old is Franz?

----------


## Gez

> French for "Where"?


That'd be "où", "ou" is French for "or".

But I think in this case we have random scribbles that vaguely resemble letters, and it's a futile exercise to attempt to decipher what it says past the first word.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> How old is Franz?


I don't think it's been said in either the books or the online strip. If he's the first dragon, he's pretty old...

The implication is that he was created by one of the Heterdynes, though, in an act of Mad Alchemy.

----------


## geoduck

At one point he says he's been a Heterodyne minion for a couple hundred of years. (Roughly, he spends a lot of time sleeping.) That would imply that he was doing something else before then and/or someone else created him. And the print novels note that 1.) All dragons are artificial alchemical creations, and 2. Amazingly, even insane alchemists were never dumb enough to make a _female_ dragon.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Amazingly, even insane alchemists were never dumb enough to make a _female_ dragon.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Don't come between a dragon and his books, even if you're a librarian.

----------


## eee

I assume Hydrargyros was another dragon.  If the Library is REALLY clever and manipulative, they've set this up and are tricking Franz into being a battering ram that will smash through the late - or maybe not so late - Hydrargyros' defenses so they can get any other books.  The trouble is, Franz may want the books, too.




> 


I always liked Fin.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Are they trying to recruit Franz to raid the lair and loot the hoard? I'd be careful with that, Franz. Unlooted hordes are unlooted for a reason.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

what is Franz going on about? 
I thought it was pretty clear that the books where still lost.

----------


## theangelJean

> what is Franz going on about? 
> I thought it was pretty clear that the books where still lost.


She didn't actually say that specifically - only that she believed he had "a copy of Volume 1 of the lost works of Masat" and that there "may be at least three."  Franz may have assumed that she meant they considered Volume One to be lost, or he might have been too busy being excited over "new books! to listen to what she hadn't said.

Edit to clarify:
From elsewhere in the story, we have been told they were all lost.
The librarian did not imply any of them had been found.
Nor did she openly state that they were still all lost before agreeing to the deal. Ambiguity all round;  humorous misunderstandings result. Re-reading, I'm not even sure what she thought she was agreeing to.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> She didn't actually say that specifically - only that she believed he had "a copy of Volume 1 of the lost works of Masat" and that there "may be at least three."  Franz may have assumed that she meant they considered Volume One to be lost, or he might have been too busy being excited over "new books! to listen to what she hadn't said.
> 
> Edit to clarify:
> From elsewhere in the story, we have been told they were all lost.
> The librarian did not imply any of them had been found.
> Nor did she openly state that they were still all lost before agreeing to the deal. Ambiguity all round;  humorous misunderstandings result. Re-reading, I'm not even sure what she thought she was agreeing to.


And as Franz rather forcefully points out, when striking a deal with dragons it is best to communicate clearly.

----------


## MDR

You know, I can't help but wonder if she is lying in some way, hiding some truths, or somehow trying to trick him.
It would actually be nice if everything is on the up-and-up and in the end they part on good terms and potential of future partnerships.

----------


## lord_khaine

> And as Franz rather forcefully points out, when striking a deal with dragons it is best to communicate clearly.


That or have doomsday ray armed backup. Honestly i think Franz was being rather dickish.

----------


## eee

Do not meddle in the affairs of dragons for you are crunchy and taste good with ketchup.  

"Be wary in dealing with Librarians, for they are sneaky SOBs."

----------


## theangelJean

> You know, I can't help but wonder if she is lying in some way, hiding some truths, or somehow trying to trick him.
> It would actually be nice if everything is on the up-and-up and in the end they part on good terms and potential of future partnerships.


Well, she knew all along that a Masat was in a dragon hoard that she needed a dragon's help to get into. Only then did she approach Franz for what she calls "Volume 1" (it's not titled as such). Then she made a deal - I now think she knew exactly what he was asking - knowing that it couldn't be fulfilled without his help - and still without revealing what she knew. Then she had to have what she really wanted "threatened" out of her ... So I agree, she's been hiding things and might still be. And I also agree that it would be nice if despite that, they worked things out and worked well together.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I think Franz's rule is: try to outsmart me and get caught - chow time. Try to outsmart me and succeed - kudos.

----------


## wingnutx

Her pants are irritating.

----------


## theangelJean

In other news: practical considerations! I was wondering when they'd get to this bit.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Who is going to watch the treasure? I vote for Jagers, but it's possible that just letting Castle know that they need to squash anyone getting near the hoard will suffice.

----------


## eee

> Who is going to watch the treasure? I vote for Jagers, but it's possible that just letting Castle know that they need to squash anyone getting near the hoard will suffice.


Baron Oublenmach might be a good choice.  It would establish to the webcomic crowd that he's still alive and now in the service of the Heterodynes; he's fairly dangerous; and given his lust for gold and treasure he'd treat Franz's hoard like it was his own.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Baron Oublenmach might be a good choice.  It would establish to the webcomic crowd that he's still alive and now in the service of the Heterodynes; he's fairly dangerous; and given his lust for gold and treasure he'd treat Franz's hoard like it was his own.


Well, persuading him to give the hoard back might be difficult; but given Franz + the Heterodynes, probably doable.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> Her pants are irritating.


The most non-Foglio things I have ever seen in this comic.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

PARTY TIME!

I like how both Franz and Mamma Gkika know what is meant by "Never caught them."  :Small Big Grin: 

Now I wonder if we are going to follow the (mis)adventurers of Franz' vacation, or going to follow the Jäger party.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> PARTY TIME!
> 
> I like how both Franz and Mamma Gkika know what is meant by "Never caught them." 
> 
> Now I wonder if we are going to follow the (mis)adventurers of Franz' vacation, or going to follow the Jäger party.


and he needs the vacation in order to get quicker, so that he may catch them

----------


## Shining Wrath

If he does catch them, he can't just eat them. Loyal servants of the Heterodynes and all that.

The hoard is safe, though. If you're a thief, do you want to try to infiltrate a jager party? Just the smell is likely to be lethal.

----------


## eee

Yeah, Franz should have gotten the Baron.  Oublenmach would have just slobbered over his gold.  The Jagers will get cake on it.

----------


## Pax1138

Is there a blonde girl hiding back there with the Jaegars?  One of Mama Gkika girls, I can't remember?

----------


## Scarlet Knight

As a Parrot-head  :Small Cool: , I must recommend this song to all readers at this time (based on a true story): 

*Spoiler*
Show

So long Boss, knock 'em dead, don't worry 'bout a thing
Wish that we could come along, we'd love to hear you sing
The limo's here, your bags are packed, the list is by the phone,
Me and Snake will watch your place and treat it like our own
Look at all this liquor
Look at all this food
It's only gonna go to waste
We're not really being rude
But the good stuff's in his closet, I swear he wouldn't mind
Hell, we''ll just shoot the lock off, I do it all the time
We're gypsies in the palace, he's left us here alone
The order of the sleepless knights will now assume the throne
We ain't got no money, we ain't got no right
But we're gypsies in the palace, we got it all tonight
There's damsels in distress out there and we got all this beer
We'll free them from their condos and bring them over here
We'll show them his Gold Records
We'll play his music loud
We'll party just like Bubba does
We'll do the old man proud
We're gypsies in the palace, there ain't no wrong or right
We're gypsies in the palace, and we're going wild tonight.
He's the greatest guy to work for, man, he's really cool
Hey Snake, this party's getting dull, throw someone in the pool
Hey, let's all take our clothes off and form a conga line
Watch out for that broken glass, hey Snake, we need more wine
We're gypsies in the palace, there ain't no wrong or right
We're gypsies in the palace and we're raising hell tonight, hey
Oh, hi there Boss, what's goin' on?
You say you're coming when?
I'll send Snake to pick you tomorrow night at ten, okay
Everybody out of here, the show is closing down
We've got to find someone to clean this up,
He's coming back to town
Hi there boss, we waxed your car, we raked and mowed
your lawn
We couldn't find enough to do in the short time you
were gone
Man it sure is peaceful here, you really got it all
If you ever hit the road again, give me and Snake
a call
We're gypsies in the palace, he's left us here alone
The order of the Sleepless Knights will now assume
the throne
We ain't got no money, we ain't got no right
But we're gypsies in the palace, we got it all tonight

----------


## wingnutx

> Is there a blonde girl hiding back there with the Jaegars?  One of Mama Gkika girls, I can't remember?


Yup, one of the Jaeger impersonators.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Ah yes. This is the sort of thing I came to this comic for...

Also in the news, I finally finished *The Night Sheriff*, by one Phil Foglio. It's not as good as Girl Genius (both comic and novels), but isn't bad by normal fantasy standards. My worst complaint is that it is a  little uneven - there were almost boring stretches, followed by sections that grabbed my attention hard (and in some cases nearly caused me to miss my stop). It has the feel that if it had started off as a comic the pacing would be better when adapted to a novel.

Still, probably worth a read if you are a big Foglio fan or interested in how he manages when going straight to print. It's good enough that if he writes another standalone novel I'll at least give it a look.

----------


## Squire Doodad

> Yeah, Franz should have gotten the Baron.  Oublenmach would have just slobbered over his gold.  The Jagers will get cake on it.


Sadly the old Baron's state of being is a bit too metanarratively preoccupied to have him pop up arbitrarily far in the future. There is always good Snakkerjape, but half of those Monster's Guild folks either get too busy reading to do any good housesitting while the other half will take a moment and help you get your next dues paid ahead of time whether you were planning on it or not.

----------


## otakuryoga

i want me a library cat!

----------


## Shining Wrath

I wonder what Franz's responsibilities are, other than his lair? And I like the huge "SECRET DRAGON LAIR" sign. It's Mechanicsburg, they monetize monsters.

Kliban is adorable, but he might try to eat us.

----------


## wingnutx

There goes Phil's sense of scale again.

----------


## Fyraltari

> There goes Phil's sense of scale again.


Look Franz has plenty of scales, it's tough to just pick one.

----------


## DavidSh

Now I wonder how many young people today know about the cartoonist Kliban, responsible for "Mousies".

----------


## Kantaki

I think Krosp would feel somewhat insulted by being described as "the Lady has a cat".  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## geoduck

> I wonder what Franz's responsibilities are, other than his lair? And I like the huge "SECRET DRAGON LAIR" sign. It's Mechanicsburg, they monetize monsters.


I do wonder if the marketing was there all along, because if it was, then the treasure-hunter Baron Oublenmach made things a lot harder for himself than he needed to.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> I do wonder if the marketing was there all along, because if it was, then the treasure-hunter Baron Oublenmach made things a lot harder for himself than he needed to.


nah, its obviously an inscription for the tourists. 
nobody expects the actual secret lair to be in the tourist scenic dungeon

----------


## St Fan

> There goes Phil's sense of scale again.


It's unfortunately quite a common trope.

The needs of panel composition tend to have precedence over any kind of scale consistency.

On the other hand, it might be a sparky trait of Franz. Changing size to better accommodate whoever he's speaking to.

----------


## wingnutx

> It's unfortunately quite a common trope.
> 
> The needs of panel composition tend to have precedence over any kind of scale consistency.
> 
> On the other hand, it might be a sparky trait of Franz. Changing size to better accommodate whoever he's speaking to.


I was thinking of the size relationship between the thief and the cat.

----------


## Kantaki

New comic

That's a lot of accumulated paid time off.
Fortunately Franz probably won't take it all at once. :Small Amused:

----------


## Mechalich

So, traditional sabbatical frequency in universities is once every seven years. At that rate, in order to have 56.25 years accumulated Franz would have to have banked 393.75 years of service. Since his conversation with the Jagers implies he's taken time off in the past, it seems he's likely been around at least 500 years, and probably considerably more.

----------


## geoduck

> So, traditional sabbatical frequency in universities is once every seven years. At that rate, in order to have 56.25 years accumulated Franz would have to have banked 393.75 years of service. Since his conversation with the Jagers implies he's taken time off in the past, it seems he's likely been around at least 500 years, and probably considerably more.


He guesses a couple hundred years at one point, but he does sleep a lot.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Franz's contract was doubtless negotiated with the old-school Heterodynes, and so may include bonus time off for each thief devoured, or something like that.

----------


## Pax1138

But more importantly, there's a street vendor selling Fried Rats who appears to be some variety of humanoid rat themselves.  Not sure, but he/she may be watching the giant riding cat very carefully.

----------


## otakuryoga

> I think Krosp would feel somewhat insulted by being described as "the Lady has a cat".


absolutely
the correct phrasing is, of course: Krosp has a The Lady

----------


## Scarlet Knight

It doesn't matter if Krosp is insulted...he's a cat. Dangle a string and all is forgiven.

----------


## tonberrian

Fifty-six years? The monster guild dues ARE worth every penny. That's like 10 weeks a year for over 290 years!

----------


## Radar

> Fifty-six years? The monster guild dues ARE worth every penny. That's like 10 weeks a year for over 290 years!


Well, as a hoard guardian without any regular replacement, his work time is probably 24/7 instead of regular 40h per week, this should come with some compensation.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Well, as a hoard guardian without any regular replacement, his work time is probably 24/7 instead of regular 40h per week, this should come with some compensation.


A good point; he should accumulate a minimum of 3 years sabbatical per 7 years worked, so perhaps it's only accumulated for about 120 years.

----------


## tyckspoon

> Well, as a hoard guardian without any regular replacement, his work time is probably 24/7 instead of regular 40h per week, this should come with some compensation.


He does get to charge 'sleeping on top of a pile of treasure' as work time. I'd think of it more as being an on-call situation then 'on duty 24/7'.

----------


## Radar

> He does get to charge 'sleeping on top of a pile of treasure' as work time. I'd think of it more as being an on-call situation then 'on duty 24/7'.


Still more billable hours than a regular 9 to 5 job. That being said, he needs to be vigilant even during his sleep, so it is a bit different than an on-call service duty.

As for today's page, we have some interesting information there:

1. "She isn't here. None of the family is."
I am wondering who else is considered family at this point. Her father or uncle? Did she merry one/more of her suitors? Built herself some kids?

2. Is it the first time we get to know von Mekken's assistant's name? I do not remember her ever saying it before.

----------


## eee

SHE'S GOT A NAME!!!

Finally.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Is Aldin also on the trail of a forbidden tome? Is the race on?

----------


## theangelJean

Noticed on re-read:
Panel four: "Chimney clean[ing] by Oc[topo]d"!
Panel one: oh, there!

----------


## geoduck

> SHE'S GOT A NAME!!!
> 
> Finally.


Nice that both ladies finally got officially named in-comic. Vidonia was at least named in the print novels.

----------


## xroads

Huh. So I wonder if we are still in Act 1 of this interlude? If so, this interlude might last longer then the arc when the lady was in the castle!  :Small Amused:

----------


## Scarlet Knight

Did Vidonia's line "None of the Family is..." catch anyone else's interest?

@V Ooops, sorry I missed it.

----------


## Radar

> Did Vidonia's line "None of the Family is..." catch anyone else's interest?


It very much did  :Small Smile: 



> 1. "She isn't here. None of the family is."
> I am wondering who else is considered family at this point. Her father or uncle? Did she merry one/more of her suitors? Built herself some kids?


Any bets on who the family consists of at that point?

----------


## Shining Wrath

Since we know that Agatha was carefully hidden by Uncle Barry, and that time travel shenanigans are afoot, it is possible that Agatha has (half) siblings. Perhaps many.
Or that the elder Heterodynes have returned from Mars.

Most likely is that Agatha has spawned. I'll guess that she's gone at least Partial Heterodyne and married [Gil | Tarvek] while also bedding [Tarvek | Gil], and that neither Gil nor Tarvek is really happy about that, but they are both putting up with it because she'll kill them if they don't. In a nice way, of course. It'd be the best way to consolidate all the power in Europa into one dynasty. Of course it'd be easy to know who fathered any particular child; the redheads are Tarvek's.

If this is far enough in the future, the kids may be old enough to engage in their own mischief, aka maneuvering to be named heir apparent.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> Most likely is that Agatha has spawned. I'll guess that she's gone at least Partial Heterodyne and married [Gil | Tarvek] while also bedding [Tarvek | Gil], and that neither Gil nor Tarvek is really happy about that, but they are both putting up with it because she'll kill them if they don't. In a nice way, of course. It'd be the best way to consolidate all the power in Europa into one dynasty. Of course it'd be easy to know who fathered any particular child; the redheads are Tarvek's.


By the end of this, I half expect Agatha to have figured out how to (legally, within European legal structure) marry them both and how to (physically, given mad S_ci_en*ce*!) have both of them father all the children. That, or they both get blown up in the final battle and she stitches them both together into one husband (that is constantly at war with itself just below the seems).

----------


## geoduck

Another possibility with "the family" is that Barry or Bill will turn up alive and end up back home.

----------


## Radar

> By the end of this, I half expect Agatha to have figured out how to (legally, within European legal structure) marry them both and how to (physically, given mad S_ci_en*ce*!) have both of them father all the children. That, or they both get blown up in the final battle and she stitches them both together into one husband (that is constantly at war with itself just below the seems).


She is the Heterodyne - there are no laws she is bound by unless that's her personal choice. Kind of like this moment of Dr Who:
_Now listen, bit of advice - tell me the truth if you think you know it, lay down the law if you're feeling brave! But, Daleks - never, ever, tell me the rules!_

She is more civilized, so she would not incinerate anyone who protests, but there is no reason for her to listen to them. After all, within Mechanicsburg she is the ultimate power.

----------


## Rodin

I wonder if Adam and Lilith count?  Agatha currently has a baby step-sister and I can easily see her insisting all three be declared part of Der Family.

----------


## Rockphed

I am guessing younger cousins or siblings, but official consort and a couple experiments is also possible.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I am guessing younger cousins or siblings, but official consort and a couple experiments is also possible.


The reason Da Boyz were detached from the regular Jager forces was to search for a Heterodyne heir. They didn't find one prior to Agatha. In the presence of time travel shenanigans almost anything is possible, but I think cousins are unlikely absent t.t.s.

----------


## Rockphed

> The reason Da Boyz were detached from the regular Jager forces was to search for a Heterodyne heir. They didn't find one prior to Agatha. In the presence of time travel shenanigans almost anything is possible, but I think cousins are unlikely absent t.t.s.


I'm thinking Barry created a few cousins during his time away.

----------


## geoduck

> I'm thinking Barry created a few cousins during his time away.


I suspect Barry is going to turn out to be gay, there have been a couple of hints in that direction over the years.

Theo and Slepnir will probably have kids, they would be cousins of Agatha. And (ew) Zola could do the nasty with someone as well.

Good to hear the Library found a new Lord High Conservator.

----------


## Shining Wrath

The Castle is not far wrong about gymnasiums being a torture chamber. _Sighs, puts on workout clothes, approaches Iron Maiden - er, curl station_

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> I suspect Barry is going to turn out to be gay, there have been a couple of hints in that direction over the years...


No, no, that was a ruse so he could get into the harem of the Iron Sheik! He is Z's real father!

----------


## Willie the Duck

> I'm thinking Barry created a few cousins during his time away.





> I suspect Barry is going to turn out to be gay.


These two positions are not incompatible. Again, especially with Sc_ience!_ as an aid.

----------


## eee

The librarian seems to be in a hurry.  Rampant acquisitiveness, or ulterior motives?




> Another possibility with "the family" is that Barry or Bill will turn up alive and end up back home.


Bill would have resumed his role as the Heterodyne if he came back; unless medical or personal factors prevented it.  Barry and any children he might have would be possible.  Punch, Judy, Theo, and other cousins and adoptees are also candidates.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> The librarian seems to be in a hurry.  Rampant acquisitiveness, or ulterior motives?


It has occurred to me that this character has needed nothing except knowing that Franz has Masat's work, a document he says is Kikelburg's, and enough knowledge to convincingly portray a librarian and they have Franz leaving his hoard and heading into danger. Could be leading Franz away to let others (perhaps better suited to dealing with Jaegers) steal his stuff, or trying to take out Franz, or any number of nefarious plots. 

Or they're just on their own dime until they show results and really want to get going.

----------


## BRC

> It has occurred to me that this character has needed nothing except knowing that Franz has Masat's work, a document he says is Kikelburg's, and enough knowledge to convincingly portray a librarian and they have Franz leaving his hoard and heading into danger. Could be leading Franz away to let others (perhaps better suited to dealing with Jaegers) steal his stuff, or trying to take out Franz, or any number of nefarious plots. 
> 
> Or they're just on their own dime until they show results and really want to get going.


They also have a library cat, although they could have gotten one of those some other way.

Most likely they think they're on the clock and want to get to the hoard before other treasure hunters do.

----------


## Gez

> I wonder if Adam and Lilith count?  Agatha currently has a baby step-sister and I can easily see her insisting all three be declared part of Der Family.


Being a Heterodyne, and therefore potentially The Heterodyne, requires more than just the name. That's why Zola's plan to impersonate the Heterodyne involved falsifying the proof by destroying or subverting the Kestle.

----------


## geoduck

> Bill would have resumed his role as the Heterodyne if he came back; unless medical or personal factors prevented it.


That's a point worth debating, the Castle has accepted Agatha as The Heterodyne, if Bill turned up alive, _would_ it automatically switch back? Would Bill still even want the title and responsibilities, since it sounds like he was far more into being an Action Hero? I assume that since the Heterodynes follow only their own rules, formal abdication is totally an option.

I personally suspect he's long dead, but that Barry will still turn up alive at some point.

----------


## runeghost

> It very much did 
> 
> Any bets on who the family consists of at that point?


Agatha + Gil & Tarvek (unless one of them is dead or missing, which seems unlikely to me) + their Spawn + any surviving Bill/Barry/(Sane-ish & de-Othered) Lucrezia (the last seems very unlikely).

----------


## Rodin

> Being a Heterodyne, and therefore potentially The Heterodyne, requires more than just the name. That's why Zola's plan to impersonate the Heterodyne involved falsifying the proof by destroying or subverting the Kestle.


Wasn't really meaning a Heterodyne that is accepted by the castle, since presumably Gilgamesh and Tarvek wouldn't fill that role even if Agatha married them.  They don't have the bloodline.  

The question I'm asking is "What does it take for Mechanicsburgers to refer to them as "the family""?  Would Gil or Tarvek count?  Adam and Lilith as honorary parents?  Who decides?

If it's just Heterodyne bloodline it's pretty limiting.  There's Agatha, any potential kids, and then Bill and Barry along with any additional offspring they had off-screen.  I don't consider them likely - in fact, I'll be rather surprised if either turns up alive.

----------


## Traab

> They also have a library cat, although they could have gotten one of those some other way.
> 
> Most likely they think they're on the clock and want to get to the hoard before other treasure hunters do.


I could see her very easily being an overeager "kid" who isnt supposed to be here or doing this but is an employee of the library. She is seeking out some grand prize of her own to prove herself or whatever. She knows hoffman is likely to know this and might try to stop her or reveal her status to franz. Or besides proving herself, this could be another instance of "Its worth 30% of my grade!" Like agatha dealt with in paris. :p

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> Bill would have resumed his role as the Heterodyne if he came back; unless medical or personal factors prevented it.  Barry and any children he might have would be possible.  Punch, Judy, Theo, and other cousins and adoptees are also candidates.


Would he though? From what we saw I'm inclined to believe he'd be happier not being THE Heterodyne, and the same would hold for both Der Kestle and the Jaegermonsters...

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Would he though? From what we saw I'm inclined to believe he'd be happier not being THE Heterodyne, and the same would hold for both Der Kestle and the Jaegermonsters...


I'm not sure the Castle / town / traditions are ready for an emeritus Heterodyne.

----------


## The Glyphstone

Considering the general temperament of pre-Boys Heterodynes, it's entirely possible no Heterodyne had ever ascended without his predecessor dying, either in a lab accident or a "lab accident". So a Current Heterodyne and Former Heterodyne at the same time might be completely out of context for Der Castle.

----------


## Rockphed

> Considering the general temperament of pre-Boys Heterodynes, it's entirely possible no Heterodyne had ever ascended without his predecessor dying, either in a lab accident or a "lab accident". So a Current Heterodyne and Former Heterodyne at the same time might be completely out of context for Der Castle.


We see markers with multiple death dates in the family vault.  I suspect the family played nicer with each other than is the norm for mad scientists.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> I'm not sure the Castle / town / traditions are ready for an emeritus Heterodyne.


I mean, treat him with as much respect as you'd give a regular member of the family (not like there was always a Heterodyne, their spouse, a single child and nobody else) and call it a day? Anything that needs _the_ Heterodyne goes to Agatha.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

> Agatha + Gil & Tarvek (unless one of them is dead or missing, which seems unlikely to me) + their Spawn + any surviving Bill/Barry/(Sane-ish & de-Othered) Lucrezia (the last seems very unlikely).


I pity any location that is being visited by that family trip.

----------


## Radar

> I pity any location that is being visited by that family trip.


Or anyone the Heterodynes decide to bestow a gift to - see the Corbetites for example.

----------


## theangelJean

New comic: in which Vipsania is reminded that the Heterodynes don't just have a hoard ... They also have a Horde.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> New comic: in which Vipsania is reminded that the Heterodynes don't just have a hoard ... They also have a Horde.


One with fangs and claws. Franz is not merely a dragon, he's the Heterodyne's dragon.

Also, it's been "over a hundred years" since he last left.

----------


## eee

Aw, that's sweet.  Vanamonde is a great seneschal,




> Would he though? From what we saw I'm inclined to believe he'd be happier not being THE Heterodyne, and the same would hold for both Der Kestle and the Jaegermonsters...


Probably true.  The Boys had a puritanical moral streak that didn't fit well with Mechanicsburg.  They made the crime families get legit, they reined in the Jagers, they destroyed the Monsters Guild (apparently for no real reason).  Agatha has allowed things to be normal for the town, and it seems to be working much better.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Aw, that's sweet.  Vanamonde is a great seneschal,
> 
> 
> 
> Probably true.  The Boys had a puritanical moral streak that didn't fit well with Mechanicsburg.  They made the crime families get legit, they reined in the Jagers, they destroyed the Monsters Guild (apparently for no real reason).  Agatha has allowed things to be normal for the town, and it seems to be working much better.


Being opposed to murder is puritanical, now?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Being opposed to murder is puritanical, now?


The crime families did some things besides murder. The Monster's Guild was not comprised solely of murderers.

----------


## wingnutx

> Being opposed to murder is puritanical, now?


It is in Mechanicsburg.

----------


## Fyraltari

> The crime families did some things besides murder. The Monster's Guild was not comprised solely of murderers.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> 


So if a French person has committed murder, should we dissolve the nation of France?

----------


## Divayth Fyr

Consider this - the general population of Mechanicsburg, bred for centuries to obey the Masters, actually went against them and helped the monsters...

----------


## Fyraltari

> So if a French person has committed murder, should we dissolve the nation of France?


The criminal families exist to do crime. The monsters' guild exist for the mosnters to be monstruous (like, "the fleshyards", come on...) That they also do some good things on the side doesn't mean that they're not bad things that should be destroyed or heavily reformed (which is what The Boys ultimately settled on).

Like, for all we like Mecanigsburg, it is a terrible place by any metric. The Jägers are fun sure, but they're a bunch of unrepentant murderers, rapists and pillagers who would gladly go back on another rampage as soon as their dear Heterodyne decides to get in touch with the family traditions.

----------


## geoduck

> The criminal families exist to do crime. The monsters' guild exist for the mosnters to be monstruous (like, "the fleshyards", come on...) That they also do some good things on the side doesn't mean that they're not bad things that should be destroyed or heavily reformed (which is what The Boys ultimately settled on).
> 
> Like, for all we like Mecanigsburg, it is a terrible place by any metric. The Jägers are fun sure, but they're a bunch of unrepentant murderers, rapists and pillagers who would gladly go back on another rampage as soon as their dear Heterodyne decides to get in touch with the family traditions.


Pretty much all of Europa is a terrible place. As long as there are Sparks, the best the common people can hope for is someone like Klaus, who keeps a lid on the worst of the depredations by deploying naked merciless force. I love reading GG, but you couldn't pay me to actually live in the setting.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Pretty much all of Europa is a terrible place. As long as there are Sparks, the best the common people can hope for is someone like Klaus, who keeps a lid on the worst of the depredations by deploying naked merciless force. I love reading GG, but you couldn't pay me to actually live in the setting.


This ^. I'd argue the best of them (Agatha, Violetta) are maybe CN on the D&D alignment scale. Gil and Klaus are LN shading toward LE. Tarvek is somewhere on the line between TN and NE. Martellus is pure LE. The Jagers are LE but whimsical about it. The Castle is NE.

I'd be interested if someone can name an important character who never crosses over into doing evil or tolerating it.

----------


## Fyraltari

Lars?67890

----------


## The Glyphstone

Life in Paris seemed to be pretty good, but Voltaire was just Klaus on a smaller scale. That's the lot of a non-Spark in Europa, a roll of the dice to see if you fall under the protection of a benevolent tyrant (Wulfenbach, Voltaire, Albia), if you suffer under the abuse of a bad one (most of the others), or if you're out in the open at the mercy of every random monster and rampaging creation that happens by.

----------


## Willie the Duck

> The criminal families exist to do crime. The monsters' guild exist for the mosnters to be monstruous (like, "the fleshyards", come on...) That they also do some good things on the side doesn't mean that they're not bad things that should be destroyed or heavily reformed (which is what The Boys ultimately settled on).
> 
> Like, for all we like Mecanigsburg, it is a terrible place by any metric. The Jägers are fun sure, but they're a bunch of unrepentant murderers, rapists and pillagers who would gladly go back on another rampage as soon as their dear Heterodyne decides to get in touch with the family traditions.





> Pretty much all of Europa is a terrible place. As long as there are Sparks, the best the common people can hope for is someone like Klaus, who keeps a lid on the worst of the depredations by deploying naked merciless force. I love reading GG, but you couldn't pay me to actually live in the setting.


With the exception of lampshading by the Castle, the comic spends a lot of time quasi-not-talking about how many-if-not-most of the characters who are helping Agatha would be helping her even if (or especially if) she was a tyrannical murderous psychopath, that the Baron basically was right, how Othar is right about sparks being a primary threat to everyone else*.
*his solution wouldn't actually work, it doesn't justify his wonton murdering of sparks, and of course this is another example of a really-awful person in the strip where we are only occasionally reminded of this fact.

In general, the Mechanicsburg monsters sit somewhere between affably evil and pirates  who don't do anything -- they rarely get to do any kind of murder and mayhem*, and when they do they will be really charming about it, but they still would have no qualms (and maybe joy) about massacring an orphanage or village or the like. 
*and when they do, it'll likely be against the forces of the Lucrecia or the Baron, try not to think too hard about how many of them are mind-controlled or just serving the current accepted government of the realm

The strip as a whole leans well shy of Narbonic/Skin Horse in terms of 'if not noted as tragic, death of unnamed hundreds is comedy;' shy of Kevin and Kell in terms of 'if the protagonist team does it, it's good, but if anyone tries to do it to them, it's bad;' and shy of Looking for Group in terms of 'pay no attention (except when we're making a joke) about how evil some of the protagonists are;' but goes far enough towards all three that it's very much a 'rooting for the maybe-not-worst' kind of story. That said, at least Agatha (and the Boys before her) really are trying to change behaviors and set standards and even set examples. Helen Narbon would have killed Lucrecia and taken her place.

----------


## eee

> Being opposed to murder is puritanical, now?


As Ivo's story pointed out, Bill pulling the plug on the crime families' normal activities put a massive crimp in the function of the Great Hospital and medical and scientific research across Europa.  The monsters were creations and victims of Mad Science, hunted and hated, who came to the Mechanicsburg Guild for a place to belong. where they could be safe.  Bill killed them and destroyed their Guild.  The Jagers were intrigued by the idea of being good guys, some of them, and could have been an effective trans-Europa police or rescue force, as Klaus eventually made them.  Bill told them to stay home and knit.  Bill was an example of hating evil so much, you did evil.  Had he been more flexible, more open to possibilities, Europa and Mechanicsburg might not have fallen into such disorder.  He was willing to give Lu a chance to reform and change ways; but apparently none of his own subjects.

----------


## geoduck

> Life in Paris seemed to be pretty good, but Voltaire was just Klaus on a smaller scale. That's the lot of a non-Spark in Europa, a roll of the dice to see if you fall under the protection of a benevolent tyrant (Wulfenbach, Voltaire, Albia), if you suffer under the abuse of a bad one (most of the others), or if you're out in the open at the mercy of every random monster and rampaging creation that happens by.


Yeah, people flocked to the city because it was relatively safe. But it sounds like, as he aged, Voltaire was just barely able to keep a lid on things. (And Albia is clearly having the same problem now in England.) It's discussed more in the print-novels, but Gil evidently spent about three-fourths of his time in the city swatting down one crazed Spark after another who was trying to take over or destroy the place.

----------


## Rockphed

> Yeah, people flocked to the city because it was relatively safe. But it sounds like, as he aged, Voltaire was just barely able to keep a lid on things. (And Albia is clearly having the same problem now in England.) It's discussed more in the print-novels, but Gil evidently spent about three-fourths of his time in the city swatting down one crazed Spark after another who was trying to take over or destroy the place.


I imagine that Voltaire let things run at a dull simmer partially because he was conserving his life but mostly to keep powerful sparks like Gilgamesh busy.

Edit: new page *Spoiler*
Show

Am I the only one who ships those two? I won't be surprised if they aren't together, but they act like an old married couple.

----------


## Gez

> Edit: new page *Spoiler*
> Show
> 
> Am I the only one who ships those two? I won't be surprised if they aren't together, but they act like an old married couple.


Well, Vidonia is technically Vanamonde's underling, as she tends to act as his secretary and assistant. That can be a problem for a relationship.
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20170927

On the other hand, he probably doesn't have the authority to fire her, since it wasn't him who hired her in the first place.
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110404

----------


## Deliverance

Oh my. Just look at the small fixtures on the handrails at the top of the staircase.

https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20220928


I wonder how many of his other ideas for using Gil's idealized image of Agatha guarding Mechanicsburg Vanamonde carried through with:

https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20160316

----------


## Shining Wrath

Suspicion confirmed: Vidania is not a librarian - or at least, not from the Incorruptible Library.

----------


## Gez

> Suspicion confirmed: Vidania is not a librarian - or at least, not from the Incorruptible Library.


Of course she's not -- she's Agatha's and Vanamonde's assistant.

The not-thief is called Vipsania.
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20220921

And I'm pretty sure her family name of Perrault is a reference to the storyteller.

----------


## theangelJean

I'm willing to bet she's not a librarian at all. If the Incorruptible Library made multiple attempts to sneak into the Castle library, any other librarian would give their eye teeth to see it too.

She may be a _collector_  of books. But I strongly doubt there is any lending involved.

----------


## eee

Oh, she's observant and intelligent!  I think they're going to find out, something is rotten in Denmark.

Does Denmark even exist here?  Sweden's got a hole in it.




> Well, Vidonia is technically Vanamonde's underling, as she tends to act as his secretary and assistant. That can be a problem for a relationship.
> https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20170927
> 
> On the other hand, he probably doesn't have the authority to fire her, since it wasn't him who hired her in the first place.
> https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110404


In the coffee shop episode she fell into the role of Agatha's assistant and secretary.  If that relationship has been formalized. it might be they're more co-equal department heads than subordinate/superior.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> I'm willing to bet she's not a librarian at all. If the Incorruptible Library made multiple attempts to sneak into the Castle library, any other librarian would give their eye teeth to see it too.
> 
> She may be a _collector_  of books. But I strongly doubt there is any lending involved.


True, if she _was_ from the Incorruptible library she should have known Aldin was here, but she _does_ know who Aldin is which implies some connection. A rogue independent librarian, perhaps. A librarian privateer scouring lost cities and forbidden pathways for literature booty to add to her hidden lair bookstacks.

----------


## InvisibleBison

I see the ability of the Girl genius fandom to leap to conclusions from the scantiest bits of evidence is undiminished. Personally, I'm not going to think that Vipsania isn't what she claims to be until we have some reason to think so less flimsy than her failing to behave in a stereotypical manner.





> Suspicion confirmed: Vidania is not a librarian - or at least, not from the Incorruptible Library.


A suggestion that something might be the case is not at all confirmation that it is the case.




> True, if she _was_ from the Incorruptible library she should have known Aldin was here


Yes, because members of an organization are always aware of the location of all other members of that organization.

----------


## The Glyphstone

Knowing the Foglios, it's probably at least a double-fake. Maybe a triple or quadruple fake.

----------


## Rockphed

> In the coffee shop episode she fell into the role of Agatha's assistant and secretary.  If that relationship has been formalized. it might be they're more co-equal department heads than subordinate/superior.


Van has a vast portfolio, Vidonia has a much smaller one. He might technically outrank her, but I don't think she reports to him. At any rate she seems to be able and willing to manipulate him the way he manipulates everyone else.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Maybe Vipsania is a former librarian, banished for misdeeds, and hoping to regain her position by bringing in a valuable tome?

----------


## Zazu Yen

> I see the ability of the Girl genius fandom to leap to conclusions from the scantiest bits of evidence is undiminished. Personally, I'm not going to think that Vipsania isn't what she claims to be until we have some reason to think so less flimsy than her failing to behave in a stereotypical manner.


Because the Foglio's have NEVER given us cause to expect the fantastical or leap to conclusions that are astronomical in distance  :Small Smile:  Besides, it's fun.





> Yes, because members of an organization are always aware of the location of all other members of that organization.


If it was just some assistant going to catalog a minor Barrons hunting lodge library, then no, I don't see many people knowing. But Aldin is in the personal library of the Heterodynes in Castle Heterodyne. I'm sure _everyone_ in the Incorruptible Library knows it. Particularly if they're trying to keep it quiet. 

I mean sure, if she's a collector for the Library and has been on assignment for a while she might not know, but she's requesting aid from a vassal of the Heterodyne, and another librarian who's on good terms with the Heterodyne is already here, it seems doubly odd not to at least want to speak.

Unless she's avoiding Aldin _specifically_. Maybe she's his younger half-sister, or a cousin, and he WOULD NOT like her going off with Franz to break into some other dragons hoard. She did refer to him by his _first_ name. Oooh, this makes sense.

----------


## Mechalich

> Unless she's avoiding Aldin _specifically_. Maybe she's his younger half-sister, or a cousin, and he WOULD NOT like her going off with Franz to break into some other dragons hoard. She did refer to him by his _first_ name. Oooh, this makes sense.


Or maybe she has the hots for him but can't bring herself to actually confess and therefore finds being in his company monstrously uncomfortable and embarrassing. That would be very much in line with past character behavior in the series.

----------


## eee

> I see the ability of the Girl genius fandom to leap to conclusions from the scantiest bits of evidence is undiminished. Personally, I'm not going to think that Vipsania isn't what she claims to be until we have some reason to think so less flimsy than her failing to behave in a stereotypical manner.


Aw, you're no fun.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Or she's Aldin's gender-bending clone through time travel shenanigans and MAD SCIENCE, and if she meets him a worm hole will open and bring in characters from XXXenophile.

----------


## Gez

> I don't think she reports to him.


We've seen her do just that before. (https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110404 again)

----------


## geoduck

> We've seen her do just that before. (https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20110404 again)


That was a few hours after they first met and she proactively volunteered her services. Whether it's still her official job X years later remains to be seen.

----------


## Adaon Nightwind

Well, they certainly seem to work well together.

https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20170927

----------


## theangelJean

You know, I always thought the coffee machine was destroyed after making that perfect cup of coffee. Would have fit narratively, and all that.

Nope, can't find it. Agatha takes the perfect brew, Vanamonde sips from it and is transported, Captain Vole kicks in the door, Agatha gives him a few decent whacks, Agatha decides everyone's better off the sooner she gets to the Castle, and the townspeople prepare to face off against Vole. Scene change.

By the time Gil tastes it, it's been toned down. What happened?

----------


## Rockphed

> You know, I always thought the coffee machine was destroyed after making that perfect cup of coffee. Would have fit narratively, and all that.
> 
> Nope, can't find it. Agatha takes the perfect brew, Vanamonde sips from it and is transported, Captain Vole kicks in the door, Agatha gives him a few decent whacks, Agatha decides everyone's better off the sooner she gets to the Castle, and the townspeople prepare to face off against Vole. Scene change.
> 
> By the time Gil tastes it, it's been toned down. What happened?


It got cold. It is no longer served in Van's personal cups. Without Agatha running the machine it makes good, but not perfect, coffee. Take your pick.

----------


## Radar

> You know, I always thought the coffee machine was destroyed after making that perfect cup of coffee. Would have fit narratively, and all that.
> 
> Nope, can't find it. Agatha takes the perfect brew, Vanamonde sips from it and is transported, Captain Vole kicks in the door, Agatha gives him a few decent whacks, Agatha decides everyone's better off the sooner she gets to the Castle, and the townspeople prepare to face off against Vole. Scene change.
> 
> By the time Gil tastes it, it's been toned down. What happened?


I think it was purposefully detuned from the perfect setting or something along those lines. It was never said directly, but it would make sense.

----------


## Gez

> By the time Gil tastes it, it's been toned down. What happened?


It's implied it's been fixed, cf. last panel here: https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20070625

Now Agatha herself doesn't seem to have taken the time to do it ("take me to the Castle *now*") but I figure anyone else could have messed a bit with the settings, starting with the cafe keeper. There's certainly no shortage of valves and knobs that could be tweaked ever-so-slightly differently on this machine: https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20070618

----------


## eee

Some sculptor had a death wish.  The clock on the nose is a nice touch.

She IS in a hurry...

----------


## Fyraltari

What is up with Franz's face in panel 1?

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> What is up with Franz's face in panel 1?


Looks like his eyes are closed for some reason? I'd assume an art error tbh.

----------


## theangelJean

I thought it was supposed to be Franz turning around looking backwards at the walls of the tunnel gate. 

It's not the sculptor's fault. It's a very good likeness of Franz. It's on whoever named the gate... Or whoever failed to keep the records of what the gate was named, allowing it to be nicknamed while Franz slept.

----------


## Gez

> I thought it was supposed to be Franz turning around looking backwards at the walls of the tunnel gate. 
> 
> It's not the sculptor's fault. It's a very good likeness of Franz. It's on whoever named the gate... Or whoever failed to keep the records of what the gate was named, allowing it to be nicknamed while Franz slept.


The lack of teeth doesn't help. Of course it'd make the gate hard to cross if they were there...-

----------


## theangelJean

> The lack of teeth doesn't help. Of course it'd make the gate hard to cross if they were there...-


Hmm. Yeah, the missing teeth does make it less dragon and more toad*. But they wouldn't be big enough to block the gate if they were correctly sized in proportion to, say, the nostrils. There's a decent gap above Franz's head, there. And if they did block the gate, well, this is Mechanicsburg!

*Had to double check, toads do not have teeth; one species of frog has true teeth, some others have tooth- or fang-like structures.

----------


## Shining Wrath

A gate usable only by pedestrians is still a gate.

Anyway, the party at Franz' place will be one for the ages.

----------


## Ailurus

Yay, amusing minor character is back!  Glad to see the monks are letting him travel.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Since nothing that size sneaks up on Mechanicsburg, Humongulous must be part of the defensive equipment for the trains. I wonder if the Castle is going to interfere? Probably, though, this is going to be a conversation.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> Yay, amusing minor character is back!  Glad to see the monks are letting him travel.


Yaaaay! Humongulous ! 

Franz's face shows the surprise that: 
a) someone wants to try
b) the voice is happy about trying
c) the voice comes from above him!

----------


## Zazu Yen

Heh, Humongulous was fun.

I'd like to nominate: "Finding new ways to stay un-squished!" as a thread name. A long shot but I think it's worth nominating  :Small Smile:

----------


## Radar

> Heh, Humongulous was fun.
> 
> I'd like to nominate: "Finding new ways to stay un-squished!" as a thread name. A long shot but I think it's worth nominating


From the depths of my heart I cast my vote at thee.  :Small Smile:

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> Heh, Humongulous was fun.
> 
> I'd like to nominate: "Finding new ways to stay un-squished!" as a thread name. A long shot but I think it's worth nominating


Duly noted.

And of course Humongulous is working with the Railway... I wonder if he's joing the party? We have a thief and a dragonborn fighter - a tank wouldn't go amiss...

----------


## Fyraltari

> Duly noted.
> 
> And of course Humongulous is working with the Railway... I wonder if he's joing the party? We have a thief and a dragonborn fighter - a tank wouldn't go amiss...


I suppose a dragon *technically* qualifies as "dragonborn" but that feels like a very misleading label. Like if I were calling myself a half-human, when both of my halves are human.

----------


## HeeJay

> I'd like to nominate: "Finding new ways to stay un-squished!" as a thread name. A long shot but I think it's worth nominating


"Finding CLEVER new ways to stay un-squished."  (It's better when quoted verbatim)

But of course I have to vote for it, this is a brilliant title, kudos.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

HOMUNGULUS! Still the primary clank at this location!  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## wingnutx

Dost thou even lyft?

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> I suppose a dragon *technically* qualifies as "dragonborn" but that feels like a very misleading label. Like if I were calling myself a half-human, when both of my halves are human.


I cite precident: If it works for half-orcs...

----------


## theangelJean

> I suppose a dragon *technically* qualifies as "dragonborn" but that feels like a very misleading label. Like if I were calling myself a half-human, when both of my halves are human.


Might even depend if you define "Dragonborn" as "descendant of dragon". If, as speculated, Franz was the first dragon, then he might not be!

----------


## Traab

I think franz might be in a bit of trouble. He seems to me to be the type of guy who talks a good game but cant really follow up on it against real threats. Remember his time during the castle siege? That other dragon was running franz's pockets until he got that super charge. Hes kinda like the local tough. Yeah he can handle himself against the other locals or regular guys, but put him up against someone trained and he is getting the roadhouse treatment.

----------


## tyckspoon

> I think franz might be in a bit of trouble. He seems to me to be the type of guy who talks a good game but cant really follow up on it against real threats. Remember his time during the castle siege? That other dragon was running franz's pockets until he got that super charge. Hes kinda like the local tough. Yeah he can handle himself against the other locals or regular guys, but put him up against someone trained and he is getting the roadhouse treatment.


While I suspect there'll be a little bit of humbling related to this (being The Dragon of Mechanicsburg doesn't carry as much weight when you aren't in reach of Der Kestle and roving bands of Jaegers showing up to back you up within minutes of a fight starting) I think you're also short selling our big green buddy quite a bit. During the siege he was running on reserve power, nearly empty. Just like the Castle. He destroyed his opponent quite handily after being charged.. and this story is with Agatha in residence as The Heterodyne and the Guild of Monsters around again to look after their members. Franz can get charged up any time he likes and his default state is likely much closer to 'overcharged' than 'empty.' (..and looking at the art, the gauges on him are pretty much all over on the Full side than the Empty side compared to the Siege of Mechanicsburg sequence.)

(..also hey found a neat bit of foreshadowing while trying to verify those pages. One of the ingredients in the wasp proofing formula Monahan's Venefirous Mus Elixir.)

----------


## Wayson

> Heh, Humongulous was fun.
> 
> I'd like to nominate: "Finding new ways to stay un-squished!" as a thread name. A long shot but I think it's worth nominating


You have my sword!  But perhaps more importantly, also my vote.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> "Finding CLEVER new ways to stay un-squished."  (It's better when quoted verbatim)
> 
> But of course I have to vote for it, this is a brilliant title, kudos.


Ah! Yes, the original "Finding clever new ways to stay un-squished." was intended. My ancient brain can't keep a quote straight for the length of a post  :Small Red Face:

----------


## Hyoi

> Ah! Yes, the original "Finding clever new ways to stay un-squished." was intended. My ancient brain can't keep a quote straight for the length of a post


From where is this quote?

----------


## theangelJean

> From where is this quote?


Current comic (Wednesday 5 October). Will link once it has a number attached.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I rise to the defense of Franz Scorchmaw and point out that even during the years when there was no Heterodyne in residence, the Castle was crippled, the Jagers were absent, and the Baron was responsible for town security - the very considerable and quite legendary hoard of the Heterodynes remained untouched. And given the Baron's opinions of Clan Heterodyne, I'm a little surprised he didn't loot it himself, as a means of weakening the power of any future heir.

No, Franz is actually All That.

----------


## Gez

> From where is this quote?


Latest page, third panel.

----------


## theangelJean

New comic. 

I don't blame Franz for mistaking Humungulous for a knight.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Theoretically, Franz can take flight and destroy Humongulous from above with his breath. Theoretically.

Practically, I think this is going to be interrupted, because those two would use trains as weapons.

Anecdotally, I recall an old "Thor versus Hulk" comic where one of them did use a train against the other, and Stan Lee put a little note at the bottom that said "No "sound effect" for this one, readers! There's no word that describes what this sounds like."

----------


## Fyraltari

> Theoretically, Franz can take flight and destroy Humongulous from above with his breath. Theoretically.


Doesn't he need his bike for that ?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Doesn't he need his bike for that ?


Indeed.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Adaon Nightwind

I also think Franz brings a lot of fighting power to the table. After all, this was his impression during the invasion of Mechanicsburg:

https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20120831

----------


## Rockphed

> I also think Franz brings a lot of fighting power to the table. After all, this was his impression during the invasion of Mechanicsburg:
> 
> https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20120831


I like him hitting someone with a giant sack of money better.

That said, I expect the corbetites to turn the fight into something constructive.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

When this storyline started, I didn't expect a lift off, but I'm glad to be wrong!  :Small Big Grin: 

This can only end with Homungulus and Franz becoming the best of friends, doesn't it? (Not that Franz would publically admit the friendship, he has standards to keep)

----------


## Shining Wrath

Franz is thinking. Humongulous I don't think plans ahead. Advantage: dragon. Which is part of why dragons are epic in D&D.

----------


## Laurentio III

> Franz is thinking. Humongulous I don't think plans ahead. Advantage: dragon. Which is part of why dragons are epic in D&D.


On the other hand, Humongulos is a single-purposed clank, and they tend to be scarily efficient in their area of experience.
Franz's power varies too much based on sleep, charge, food and motivation.

Anyway, it's going to be good.

----------


## tyckspoon

> I like him hitting someone with a giant sack of money better.
> 
> That said, I expect the corbetites to turn the fight into something constructive.


A dragon and a giant macho clank brawling in a trainyard seems far more likely to be deconstructive >.>

----------


## geoduck

I expect it's going to be over pretty fast, and Franz will win.

----------


## smuchmuch

I'm thinking given how one of the elements the pannels were showing was a water tower and Humongulus seems to be powered by some kind of furnace inside that Franz is about to get _*crafty*_. 

... I mean in the "smart" sense not in the "build something to win the fight" (...what ? ... I mean, given what comic this is, it felt like a necessary precision, it' not like some sparks hven't pulled building deathrays in the middle of a fight a couple of time...)

----------


## Shining Wrath

> On the other hand, Humongulos is a single-purposed clank, and they tend to be scarily efficient in their area of experience.
> Franz's power varies too much based on sleep, charge, food and motivation.
> 
> Anyway, it's going to be good.


A single-purpose clank, if you can put them in a situation they are not prepared for, tends to go off the rails. In this case that may be literal.

----------


## Laurentio III

> A single-purpose clank, if you can put them in a situation they are not prepared for, tends to go off the rails. In this case that may be literal.


That is the reason I thnk it will be good.
Homungulus is a "strength" clank. So it's going to pull, push, lift. By the way it moves, it is fast and coordinate enough to roll a good punch, and Franz is tough but not invulnerable.
Anyway, "smart" is not included in it's description, and Franz is smart. Given the look he gave around, there is a train full of trickery in arrival.

The point is: Franz doesn't know Homungulus. He improperly tagged it as a "knight" because of the look, so he could expect it to act as one, instead of Hulk Hogan under steroids. Knights are honorable and fight to kill or subdue. Mass moving clanks don't.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> That is the reason I thnk it will be good.
> Homungulus is a "strength" clank. So it's going to pull, push, lift. By the way it moves, it is fast and coordinate enough to roll a good punch, and Franz is tough but not invulnerable.
> Anyway, "smart" is not included in it's description, and Franz is smart. Given the look he gave around, there is a train full of trickery in arrival.
> 
> The point is: Franz doesn't know Homungulus. He improperly tagged it as a "knight" because of the look, so he could expect it to act as one, instead of Hulk Hogan under steroids. Knights are honorable and fight to kill or subdue. Mass moving clanks don't.


IIRC, Humongulous was a Heterodyne creation captured by / given to the Corborite monks. If that's true, Franz has likely read of him. Also, I'm not sure what Humongulous' programming is. "Kill everything in your path" seems unlikely, as he's helping with reconstruction.

----------


## The Glyphstone

I think you're conflating Humungulous with The Beast. Humungulous was an amusing background detail/tertiary character in the train arc but I dont remember any backstory listed.

----------


## theangelJean

Wasn't Humungulous a Knights of Jove lackey sent to disrupt the train lines when they were trying to hunt down Agatha? Was he the one who got distracted by shiny tech (suggesting Spark) or was that the other one?

----------


## Laurentio III

> Wasn't Humungulous a Knights of Jove lackey sent to disrupt the train lines when they were trying to hunt down Agatha? Was he the one who got distracted by shiny tech (suggesting Spark) or was that the other one?


Humongulus is a giant clank used to lift, pull or move items in the Corbettite Depot Fortress of St. Szpac.
We have seen it fighting once, against a train using magnetic manipolation, and Humongulus' attack was to grasp it and keep it pinned.
Plus, is a funny guy.

----------


## geoduck

The only thing we've heard about Humongulus's past is that he/it evidently used to level mountains.

----------


## Thomas Cardew

> Wasn't Humungulous a Knights of Jove lackey sent to disrupt the train lines when they were trying to hunt down Agatha? Was he the one who got distracted by shiny tech (suggesting Spark) or was that the other one?


You're confusing Count Wolkerstorfer, who is the spark who attacked them, and Humongulus, the giant lifting clank. Understandable since they look relatively similar and appeared in the same arc.

Mostly just posting for his name, an enemy like that deserves to be treasured.

----------


## Grim Portent

Humongulus hasn't been given an origin, but we were told he levelled mountains at some point prior to being given the job of moving things around the Corbetite monastery. I'd guess he was built by a random spark to be the strongest clank there is, presumably for military use, but given the nature of things in Girl Genius he wound up being a mechanical gym-bro and just wandered off to try and move big things rather than fighting.

Pretty sure he's not a Heterodyne creation like the Beast is. No trilobite crests and he doesn't react to Agatha's presence at any point. He's just another sparky abomination the monks took the task of containing.

----------


## Ailurus

Humungulous is the clank!

----------


## Laurentio III

*I see that Humongulus really took the thread! This is, in fact, how it is done! Behold! Humongulus will now be the main thread argument until next page! Yes! Excellent debate! Humongulus is impressed! Frigus!*

----------


## tyckspoon

> *I see that Humongulus really took the thread! This is, in fact, how it is done! Behold! Humongulus will now be the main thread argument until next page! Yes! Excellent debate! Humongulus is impressed! Frigus!*


*Humongulous is the primary clank of discussion in this area!*

----------


## Traab

> *humongulous is the primary clank of discussion in this area!*


dost thou even discuss?!

----------


## eee

I still can't see what Franz is up to, but it should be obvious to Humongous that the dragon is controlling this fight and caution would be wise.

----------


## wingnutx

I'm guessing that Frantz was going to use that smokestack as a funnel to focus his flame.

----------


## Adaon Nightwind

I am rather with Smuchmuch on this one - Franz seems to plan something with the Water Tower.

----------


## geoduck

> I am rather with Smuchmuch on this one - Franz seems to plan something with the Water Tower.


That's the obvious option, dousing the clank's fire somehow.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Humongulus does get all the good lines.

----------


## Rockphed

Thread title: "It is a shame shared by many!"

I wonder how Humongulus will take losing.  Will he take it in stride, or will he mope for decades on his loss?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Thread title: "It is a shame shared by many!"
> 
> I wonder how Humongulus will take losing.  Will he take it in stride, or will he mope for decades on his loss?


He seems like the sort who would congratulate Franz, unless he thought Franz cheated.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> Thread title: "It is a shame shared by many!"


Duly noted.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Watch out for dragon's tales. And Humongulous says he's impervious to water, but is he impervious to having a water tower dropped on him?

----------


## InvisibleBison

I suspect Humongulus is about to learn the difference between "water resistant" and "waterproof".

----------


## Shining Wrath

Ooo, thought: Franz is holding a funnel, while near a large source of water. Can he use the funnel to pour the water directly inside Humongulous? I don't see an opening of sufficient size, but a dragon may be able to create one.

And then, having filled him with water, unleash the flame breath and convert the water to steam.

----------


## Traab

> Ooo, thought: Franz is holding a funnel, while near a large source of water. Can he use the funnel to pour the water directly inside Humongulous? I don't see an opening of sufficient size, but a dragon may be able to create one.
> 
> And then, having filled him with water, unleash the flame breath and convert the water to steam.


Also thermal expansion and contraction. He may just fire breath him till he glows white, then water him back to room temp. His armor will be riddled with weak points and brittle metal. Making it easier for a franz fist to smash him good.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Also thermal expansion and contraction. He may just fire breath him till he glows white, then water him back to room temp. His armor will be riddled with weak points and brittle metal. Making it easier for a franz fist to smash him good.


"Anneal before Franz!"

----------


## St Fan

Unsurprisingly, those little feet prove to be weak spot for a Clank that top-heavy.

----------


## Laurentio III

> Also thermal expansion and contraction. He may just fire breath him till he glows white, then water him back to room temp. His armor will be riddled with weak points and brittle metal. Making it easier for a franz fist to smash him good.


Also known as "Uncanny X-Men (1984) #177" plot.

----------


## The Glyphstone

I'm skeptical of any plan that results in severe/permanent damage to Humungulous. It doesn't feel in character for Franz to go for a 'killing blow' in what is supposed to be a 'fun' fight.

My bet is that he's going to topple the water tower on top of Humungulous. He might be water resistant, but if he's pinned on his back the necessary leverage to get up again might be hard.

----------


## Traab

> I'm skeptical of any plan that results in severe/permanent damage to Humungulous. It doesn't feel in character for Franz to go for a 'killing blow' in what is supposed to be a 'fun' fight.
> 
> My bet is that he's going to topple the water tower on top of Humungulous. He might be water resistant, but if he's pinned on his back the necessary leverage to get up again might be hard.


But lifting is what he DOES! You might as well challenge franz to a treasure guarding contest!  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## The Glyphstone

> But lifting is what he DOES! You might as well challenge franz to a treasure guarding contest!


That would just make Franz's victory all the more ironic.

----------


## Shining Wrath

The water tower by itself is not sufficient. The water tower with Franz sitting atop it might pin him down.

I still think that Franz continuing to hold the funnel is significant, and that funnel + water + prone Humongulous will be the key to victory.

----------


## geoduck

There's a gap in the back of Humungulous's armor, between his head and torso. The water will get poured directly in there through the funnel.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Thread title nomination: "Impressive yet pointless".

----------


## Laurentio III

> The water tower by itself is not sufficient. The water tower with Franz sitting atop it might pin him down.


Franz has been hit in the face while weakened, by a bigger dragon, and hardly bulged. Meanwhile Humongulous' casual punch sent him flying.
The same clank which is said to move mountains, and effortlessy lifted a train engine just a minute before.
I seriously doubt that anything Franz can pile in its back would sort any effect. Squatting a water tower is probably a thing that Humongulous does for fun.

Plus, kudos for the main clank in the area for disarming Franz's funnel. It is not a dumb dumbell raiser! We have a smart guy here.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> Thread title nomination: "Impressive yet pointless".


Duly noted.


I note that Humongulous' armour is water resistant rather than waterproof.

----------


## Laurentio III

> I note that Humongulous' armour is water resistant rather than waterproof.


In Girl Genius' universe you don't brag about being impervious to something, least someone hears you and takes it as a mission.

----------


## Ailurus

Yay!  Humongulous is the Friend now!

----------


## Shining Wrath

Two skilled warriors have achieved mutual respect. Charming! And perhaps this means that if Franz gets into trouble, there's an ally ready for Monk Ex Machinia aid - after all, where don't the Corbittes have a rail line in Europa? Humongous can plausibly always be nearby.

----------


## Pax1138

Hunh, I was expecting the solution to be a little more complex, but you know what?  I'm glad it was that simple and that we can now move on!

----------


## Radar

> Yay!  Humongulous is the Friend now!


Increadible valor! Respectable muscles!  :Small Wink: 

I really like Humongulous. He has a very high self esteem, but is secure enough in it to truly respect someone who could win against him.

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> Yay!  Humongulous is the Friend now!


an opportunity to patronize can be considered a win.

----------


## Radar

My bet is that the monk in the first panel made a bet about who will win and now has to pay up. Any takers?  :Small Wink:

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Well, this looks like a chekovs gun if I have ever seen one.

I hope Franz enjoys the stable cart.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Grim Portent

Y'know I would have thought there'd be an actual car or two dedicated to the usage of monsters, sapient clanks and other large creatures who might want the comfort of a proper seat, as opposed to one used for livestock.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> My bet is that the monk in the first panel made a bet about who will win and now has to pay up. Any takers?


No taker here. Monk bet on the Corbitte clank; local bet on the Heterodyne dragon.




> Well, this looks like a chekovs gun if I have ever seen one.
> 
> I hope Franz enjoys the stable cart.


Yes, somebody is going to get punched later in this story.




> Y'know I would have thought there'd be an actual car or two dedicated to the usage of monsters, sapient clanks and other large creatures who might want the comfort of a proper seat, as opposed to one used for livestock.


Perhaps the straw is for the benefit of Kliban the kitteh?

Anyway, I'm a little apprehensive about going into a car with only one door that can be locked from the outside.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> Well, this looks like a chekovs gun if I have ever seen one.


I'm not sure. Humongulus isn't going to be accompanying Franz and Vipsania, so it's unclear how they'd call him to resolve a problem in a narratively satisfying way.

----------


## Rakaydos

> Perhaps the straw is for the benefit of Kliban the kitteh?
> 
> Anyway, I'm a little apprehensive about going into a car with only one door that can be locked from the outside.


That's like being locked into one of those tratitional japaneese buildings with paper walls. Nothing that Franz couldnt tear through.

----------


## wingnutx

Get ready to get stupid.

----------


## Radar

> Get ready to get stupid.


Well... if you dare.

----------


## Smoutwortel

> Also known as "Uncanny X-Men (1984) #177" plot.


"If I had known it was a movie plot I wouldn't have proposed it" schlocks fragsuit from schlockmercenary.

----------


## Grim Portent

> I'm not sure. Humongulus isn't going to be accompanying Franz and Vipsania, so it's unclear how they'd call him to resolve a problem in a narratively satisfying way.


Simple option is that the problem follows our dynamic duo back to Mechaniscburg

Other option is that Humongulous is getting on the train and getting off at the same place in order to load something onto it, and a chase sequence leads a fight to the train yard.


I suspect it's set up for a brick joke myself though. Franz and the librarian go have their little adventure go their seperate ways, Franz returns to store his new books nice and safe in his hoard and the dragon who is presumed dead shows up looking for his collection only for Franz to sick our favourite clank on him.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Suspicion level rising slightly. Kliban may be disposable.

----------


## Gez

> Suspicion level rising slightly. Kliban may be disposable.


Kaja would never allow Phil to harm a cat. Kaja loves cats, especially big scary kitties (may not actually be cats).

I think the point was just to establish that Franz (and Kliban) have to travel in the cattle car, while Vipsania goes into the passenger car. In fact, if anything, something may happen to Vip instead.

 Reminds me of this webcomic.

----------


## theangelJean

Today's comic: travelling as a dragon.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Princess:pea::dragon:no_gold.

----------


## Deliverance

> Kaja would never allow Phil to harm a cat. Kaja loves cats, especially big scary kitties (may not actually be cats).
> 
> I think the point was just to establish that Franz (and Kliban) have to travel in the cattle car, while Vipsania goes into the passenger car. In fact, if anything, something may happen to Vip instead.
> 
>  Reminds me of this webcomic.


Vipsania is letting her cat mount into the cattle car _without removing its tack_ and given that she is leaving them immediately afterwards, it will probably stay on unless the cat is capable of removing its own tack, and nothing of the way it is drawn suggests this possibility. While this won't hurt the cat it in the short run, if this is a regular occurrence it will, and either way she is definitely treating it poorly if she leaves it on.

----------


## Gez

> Vipsania is letting her cat mount into the cattle car _without removing its tack_ and given that she is leaving them immediately afterwards, it will probably stay on unless the cat is capable of removing its own tack, and nothing of the way it is drawn suggests this possibility. While this won't hurt the cat it in the short run, if this is a regular occurrence it will, and either way she is definitely treating it poorly if she leaves it on.


Counterpoint: this is a webcomic.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

Ah, much better! Now panel 3 has Foglio pants.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Vispania is up to no good. Why does she need a guide to choo-choo terrain? No for Franz's benefit, I'm certain. And the monk looks like a spy, not a true monk, based on the gem in the middle of his forehead.

Also, little detail - the pouch of coins is stitched together, as though it's been near a cut-purse.

----------


## eee

Good golly, those are tight sleeping compartments!

----------


## wingnutx

> Ah, much better! Now panel 3 has Foglio pants.


Phil delivers the goods.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Ah, much better! Now panel 3 has Foglio pants.


"Foglio pants"? But also, panel 4, man.

----------


## Laurentio III

> Counterpoint: this is a webcomic.


Counter-counterpoint: it's an _excellent_ webcomic, usually well written.

----------


## The Glyphstone

Counter-counter-counter-point-point:  It's a well-written webcomic, emphasis on comic. Unless the cst being left with its tack on can be used for a punchline or plot beat, its  unlikely to be given any attention.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Multi counter point - Kliban may be capable of donning and removing their own gear.

----------


## InvisibleBison

Kliban is almost certainly the creation of a Spark, so it's entirely possible that it doesn't need to have its tack removed, or that its tack is actually part of its body.

----------


## Gez

> Counter-counterpoint: it's an _excellent_ webcomic, usually well written.


Realistic animal handling is not exactly the point of Girl Genius, especially considering it is dreadfully lacking in realistic animals.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> "Foglio pants"? But also, panel 4, man.


I stand chastised. Panel 4 is truly art.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

Well, looks like Franz _did_ get himself into trouble...

----------


## Thomas Cardew

On the one hand... an intermission from the intermission. On the other... Bowserette Agatha. Decisions. Decisions.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I am sure it would tickle Franz's ego to be described as "A fell creature of the Heterodynes themselves!". If he gets the Iram Solis, the monks fear that all fell will break loose.

But this raises a question. If you're not going to give Vipsania the book, why show it to her? If you think the plan results in a fell creature of the Heterodynes becoming immensely powerful, does raising the price really compensate?

Are the Corborite monks going to insist that Vipsania kill Franz? Because that's pretty difficult.

Also: if Franz became much more powerful, might he turn on the Heterodynes? He seems content with his role, and loyal, but he is a dragon, and the lure of the Heterodyne's library and other hoard items must be tempting.

----------


## eee

He's got a point.

I wonder how the monks found out what she was up to?

----------


## Fyraltari

> Are the Corborite monks going to insist that Vipsania kill Franz? Because that's pretty difficult.


I think demanding the iram solis to be handed to the order for safekeeping would be more in line with their m.o.



> He's got a point.
> 
> I wonder how the monks found out what she was up to?


Presumably this book containd info about the hoard or the surrounding area. Knowing that the dragon is dead and seeing her with another dragon, it wouldn't be that hard to guess.

----------


## Radar

> I am sure it would tickle Franz's ego to be described as "A fell creature of the Heterodynes themselves!". If he gets the Iram Solis, the monks fear that all fell will break loose.
> 
> But this raises a question. If you're not going to give Vipsania the book, why show it to her? If you think the plan results in a fell creature of the Heterodynes becoming immensely powerful, does raising the price really compensate?
> 
> Are the Corborite monks going to insist that Vipsania kill Franz? Because that's pretty difficult.
> 
> Also: if Franz became much more powerful, might he turn on the Heterodynes? He seems content with his role, and loyal, but he is a dragon, and the lure of the Heterodyne's library and other hoard items must be tempting.


Basically, the priority for the monks is not to let Franz get Iram Solis, so they try to make Vipsania cooperate on that goal: dangle the prize in front of her nose and make demands.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Franz must know of Iram Solis, but I don't think he's shown any particular interest in it - so, maybe Vipsania won't have to negotiate too hard?
OTOH, Franz seems to have a real anger problem with someone trying to go back on a deal.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Being called a "Fell creature from the Heterodynes themselves" should make Franz happy.  :Small Big Grin: 

I'm not sure if its smart to come between a librarian and their book.

----------


## Grim Portent

> Franz must know of Iram Solis, but I don't think he's shown any particular interest in it - so, maybe Vipsania won't have to negotiate too hard?
> OTOH, Franz seems to have a real anger problem with someone trying to go back on a deal.


He could know about it, want it and just be keeping it secret.

I don't think he is mind you, Franz isn't the rampaging sort. He's a bit lazy, a bit of a grifter as we've seen, a dirty fighter and a bit dim at times, but I get the impression that any rampaging he did was hundreds of years ago, and now he mostly wants to nap.

Keeping a weapon like Iram Solis away from him is probably a good idea anyway, but it's not like he couldn't get a death ray or something from Agatha if he asked nicely anyway. She'd probably even enjoy the challenge involved in making one he can use.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> He could know about it, want it and just be keeping it secret.
> 
> I don't think he is mind you, Franz isn't the rampaging sort. He's a bit lazy, a bit of a grifter as we've seen, a dirty fighter and a bit dim at times, but I get the impression that any rampaging he did was hundreds of years ago, and now he mostly wants to nap.
> 
> Keeping a weapon like Iram Solis away from him is probably a good idea anyway, but it's not like he couldn't get a death ray or something from Agatha if he asked nicely anyway. She'd probably even enjoy the challenge involved in making one he can use.


Franz: "I really kinda wanted that Iram Solis, but Vipsania picked it".
Agatha: "Why didn't you say so?" _Enters lab_ _Enters Madness Place_ _Cackles in glee_
Result: Iram Solis Mark Two, which not only produces a gale from hell, but also adds a nice lemony scent to the ashes!

----------


## Traab

> Franz: "I really kinda wanted that Iram Solis, but Vipsania picked it".
> Agatha: "Why didn't you say so?" _Enters lab_ _Enters Madness Place_ _Cackles in glee_
> Result: Iram Solis Mark Two, which not only produces a gale from hell, but also adds a nice lemony scent to the ashes!


Seriously, thats what I was thinking. If franz wants some super destructive bit of gear, he can always ask his heterodyne to make him one. This woman literally builds death rays in her sleep, imf airly sure the mark 2 would be an entirely new level of war crime powerful if someone suggested she build it. The only interest in it he would have is more academic/collectible focused. A bit of history in his hoard taken from another dragons hoard would be just awesome for him.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Seriously, thats what I was thinking. If franz wants some super destructive bit of gear, he can always ask his heterodyne to make him one. This woman literally builds death rays in her sleep, imf airly sure the mark 2 would be an entirely new level of war crime powerful if someone suggested she build it. The only interest in it he would have is more academic/collectible focused. A bit of history in his hoard taken from another dragons hoard would be just awesome for him.


Ooo, an Iram Solis that has an adjustable nozzle, so you can focus down and melt titanium, or widen it out and ignite whole counties.

----------


## Radar

> Ooo, an Iram Solis that has an adjustable nozzle, so you can focus down and melt titanium, or widen it out and ignite whole counties.


And then use it to light up the candles on the far end of the room, because you can't be bothered to stand up and walk there.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Agi Hammerthief

> And then use it to light up the candles on the far end of the room, because you can't be bothered to stand up and walk there.


Im guessing thats what it was originally build for.

----------


## theangelJean

> He could know about it, want it and just be keeping it secret.
> 
> I don't think he is mind you, Franz isn't the rampaging sort. He's a bit lazy, a bit of a grifter as we've seen, a dirty fighter and a bit dim at times, but I get the impression that any rampaging he did was hundreds of years ago, and now he mostly wants to nap.
> 
> Keeping a weapon like Iram Solis away from him is probably a good idea anyway, but it's not like he couldn't get a death ray or something from Agatha if he asked nicely anyway. She'd probably even enjoy the challenge involved in making one he can use.


That assumes he can get ahold of her in the first place, though. She seems to be off having adventures a lot, and he sleeps most of the time.

----------


## Fyraltari

More importantly, that's not something they can control. Sure the Heterodyne handing Franz another scorch ray would be just as bad as Franz getting this one, but the sexond situation they can do something about.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> That assumes he can get ahold of her in the first place, though. She seems to be off having adventures a lot, and he sleeps most of the time.


He could leave a request with von Mekkhan if she's not around when he gets back.

----------


## Shining Wrath

The monks get all the Spark-made devilry? That could be considerable, since Hydrargyros murdered his master who made the Iram Solis. How many Sparks make only one gadget?
I wonder if Franz will agree? Do the monks think they can compel his agreement? Even if Franz can't use, e.g., a Widdershins Thingbobble, perhaps the Lady would want it?

Confirmed, though: the monks, who are well-informed, think that Vipsania is a librarian.

Panel 6: Foglio teeth.

----------


## BRC

> The monks get all the Spark-made devilry? That could be considerable, since Hydrargyros murdered his master who made the Iram Solis. How many Sparks make only one gadget?
> I wonder if Franz will agree? Do the monks think they can compel his agreement? Even if Franz can't use, e.g., a Widdershins Thingbobble, perhaps the Lady would want it?
> 
> Confirmed, though: the monks, who are well-informed, think that Vipsania is a librarian.
> 
> Panel 6: Foglio teeth.


My current theory is that Vipsania's Credentials are valid, but she's gone rogue in this instance, she's in pursuit of some personal mission.

Or, alternatively, she had to catch this specific train to meet with this specific monk, which is why she was so worried about missing it.

----------


## Gez

> Or, alternatively, she had to catch this specific train to meet with this specific monk, which is why she was so worried about missing it.


That's most certainly the case, regardless of whether or not anything else applies.

----------


## Radar

> My current theory is that Vipsania's Credentials are valid, but she's gone rogue in this instance, she's in pursuit of some personal mission.
> 
> Or, alternatively, she had to catch this specific train to meet with this specific monk, which is why she was so worried about missing it.


Yes to the latter, but we might also want to consider that the trains most likely do not happen to ride all that often, so missing a train might mean days of delay instead of some hours.

----------


## theangelJean

I wonder if the book is a map of the travels of the Beast while it roamed about uncontrolled, and if that was how Hydrargos was killed? The Beast alone would explain why the Corbettites are so leery of Heterodyne creations.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

I do like the variant on the "If you lived here you'd be home by now" poster. We used to have one of those just outside Barking - ironically the sensible variant rather than the mad one. Yes, I do get out at the next stop.

Oh, and I would be remiss if I didn't: "If you lived here - you'd be mad by now" as a thread title...

----------


## Traab

> My current theory is that Vipsania's Credentials are valid, but she's gone rogue in this instance, she's in pursuit of some personal mission.
> 
> Or, alternatively, she had to catch this specific train to meet with this specific monk, which is why she was so worried about missing it.


I no longer care as much about her credentials, my suspicions are on monk boy here. Im expecting a backstabbing here for some power hungry ex monk. You have to admit it must be tempting. All those insanely powerful artifacts right there, with many of them having enough info to use, and of course, they have extensive knowledge of other dangerous devices out there they want to get ahold of, sort of a doohickey version of the incorruptible library and its book fixation. Surely nobody will notice if one of those free floating artifacts happens to vanish into my personal collection.

----------


## DavidSh

> I do like the variant on the "If you lived here you'd be home by now" poster. We used to have one of those just outside Barking - ironically the sensible variant rather than the mad one.


I suppose the inhabitants of Barking (Barkingers? Barkers? Dogs?) are rather tired of references to the phrase "barking mad" by now.

----------


## Rockphed

> Oh, and I would be remiss if I didn't: "If you lived here - you'd be mad by now" as a thread title...


"If you comment here, you'll go MAD!  MAD I SAY!!!!!"

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> I suppose the inhabitants of Barking (Barkingers? Barkers? Dogs?) are rather tired of references to the phrase "barking mad" by now.


I was somewhat blindsided the day one of my team realised where I was on the train map, and said "So, you really are one stop beyond Barking...". 15 years and no-one had made that reference before...

----------


## Laurentio III

New (old?) character.
And the giant cat can remove its own saddle. Plus, he is not scared of dragons. Trully catlike.

----------


## Fyraltari

> New (old?) character.


Don't think we've seen her before. Too old to be Van's daughter. I'm guessing sister, niece or cousin.

----------


## Gez

> New (old?) character.
> And the giant cat can remove its own saddle. Plus, he is not scared of dragons. Trully catlike.


Also it seems the dragon's travel hoard has disappeared...

----------


## Shining Wrath

Lumi has a tattoo on her left arm, and a sword. Did the von Mekken family send her to protect Franz? That seems presumptuous. Dragons by definition don't need much protection. OTOH, the parting speech indicates that the dragon does travel with the full protection of Mechanicsburg behind him.

Kliban is definitely a cat. Sleeping on top of people, getting upset when they move, and then stealing food? Very feline.

Lumi also has nice pants in panel 5.

----------


## Gez

> Kliban is definitely a cat. Sleeping on top of people, getting upset when they move, and then stealing food? Very feline.


It's not stealing! Lumi was offering sausages, Kliban gladly accepted.

----------


## lord_khaine

> And the giant cat can remove its own saddle. Plus, he is not scared of dragons. Truly catlike.


Or possibly someone came and removed it a little later.

Meanwhile. What this is about is interesting.
Does seem like the Mekkam family send someone to watch Franz's back. 
That your a dragon dont matter to much in a world of death rays and spark weapons.

----------


## theangelJean

See, my initial thought was "stowaway" or "renegade". We've been suspicious of everyone else in this story so far, why not one more?

Edit: I just now noticed the etymology of the von Mekkan/Mekkhan/Mekken family surname. Took me long enough...

----------


## Fyraltari

> Edit: I just now noticed the etymology of the von Mekkan/Mekkhan/Mekken family surname. Took me long enough...


I'm not sure what you are getting at. I kind of always assumed they were the von Mekkhan of *Mecan*icsburg.

Edit: also the pixie hat is going to take some getting used to.

----------


## theangelJean

> I'm not sure what you are getting at. I kind of always assumed they were the von Mekkhan of *Mecan*icsburg.


It's obvious when you think about it. Especially when they put in the 'h', which might be new. I don't know why it took _me_ so long, is all.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> Lumi also has nice pants in panel 5.


Yes, I like how the cut lifts and separates...

----------


## Shining Wrath

I just realized that the bottom of Lumi's scabbard is non-standard. It looks like a spigot, or maybe a gun barrel?

----------


## InvisibleBison

> I just realized that the bottom of Lumi's scabbard is non-standard. It looks like a spigot, or maybe a gun barrel?


I think it looks kind of like a scroll case, though I don't imagine that it is one.

----------


## Ailurus

"Bad luck" like that 3 times in a row?  Don't think it's possible for me to get more suspicious of Vipsania, but I'm getting there.

----------


## Shining Wrath

7 year old Lumi booped Franz. That is possibly the most adorable thing I've read in GG. I wonder what trinket Franz sold her, and at what price?

Vipsania is now definitely on the "very, very sus" list, heading towards "almost as sus as the monk with a Slaad control gem".

Kliban scored the other sausage.

And both of them said "No promises" together. Which one will be quick enough to score "Jinx! you owe me a drink!".

----------


## wingnutx

I really like Lumi so far.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Hmm. That does explain why Vipsana didn't want to meet Aldin. 

I like Lumi. And of course there is a gang cheer. :Small Big Grin:

----------


## theangelJean

> "almost as sus as the monk with a Slaad control gem".


Hang on, what?

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Hang on, what?


Dude's got a gemstone embedded in his forehead. Nothing holding it in place that I can see. Looks like a Slaad control gem to me.

----------


## geoduck

I hope it turns out that Vipsana is just trying really really hard to become a full-fledged Librarian, and isn't Actually Evil.

----------


## Rakaydos

Noone's pointed out yet that the party has gained a Cleric and Rogue? That makes the Librarian the caster and the Dragon the fighter.

Though the implications upthread that the rogue is probably the most trustworthy one is amusing, in a "inverting the trope" kinda way.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Noone's pointed out yet that the party has gained a Cleric and Rogue? That makes the Librarian the caster and the Dragon the fighter.
> 
> Though the implications upthread that the rogue is probably the most trustworthy one is amusing, in a "inverting the trope" kinda way.


Lumi gives me more of a barbarian vibe - big sword and all that. 'Stealing' from Franz's loot is a Mechanicsburg tradition and doesn't make your adult career choice that of a rogue.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Lumi gives me more of a barbarian vibe - big sword and all that. 'Stealing' from Franz's loot is a Mechanicsburg tradition and doesn't make your adult career choice that of a rogue.


When it comes to looking after a dragon, muscle is the least of your priorities.

If we must map them to D&D classes, then sneaky Vispania is the rogue while brave but (presumably) smart and upbeat Lumi is the bard.

----------


## BRC

Using the classic 4 class split, I would go with

Vispana is the ROGUE, sneaky and skilled. 

The Unnamed Monk is our CLERIC, a man of faith (And Trains).

Lumi is our FIGHTER, with that big sword.

Franz is filling the role of the WIZARD here, in the classic dungeon crawl the Wizard's job wasn't to fireball, it was to use supernatural abilities to bypass obstacles that could not be bypassed normally. Franz isn't casting spells exactly, and he's not squishy, but he's here to do the things humans can't.

----------


## Traab

Now im kinda wondering the same thing. Is our library lady actually more or less on the up and up and it turns out everyone ELSE is going to be doing all the back stabbery? From what we learned about her history of entire teams vanishing where only she survives it sounds sketchy, but not everyone has one of those teams where they get into trouble and always manage to come out married to princesses and forging peace between underground mole people factions. So far monk boy is the sketchiest character here.

----------


## Ailurus

So, Lumi may be in a bit of trouble here, as "no one rides unshriven and unquestioned".  May give us a chance to learn more about the monk, though, based on his reaction to the new stowaway.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> So, Lumi may be in a bit of trouble here, as "no one rides unshriven and unquestioned".  May give us a chance to learn more about the monk, though, based on his reaction to the new stowaway.


Why do you think she's a stowaway? Franz didn't know she was on the train until he woke up, but he's no Corbettite. She may well have gone through all the rituals needed to licitly travel on the train, then sneaked into Franz's car.

----------


## Gez

> Why do you think she's a stowaway? Franz didn't know she was on the train until he woke up, but he's no Corbettite. She may well have gone through all the rituals needed to licitly travel on the train, then sneaked into Franz's car.


We see her flying machine. So she didn't board the train at a station...

It is possible that she went on and sought to regularize her presence by paying a fine and confessing or whatever, but it's also possible she didn't. We'll see how the Brother react in the next page I guess.

----------


## InvisibleBison

> We see her flying machine. So she didn't board the train at a station...


Oh, yeah, I missed that. I guess there is some irregularity to her presence.

----------


## Shining Wrath

She boarded the plane using a Heterodyne Spark item, either built by them or captured by them. There will be questions if she didn't "check in".

----------


## Fyraltari

> She boarded the plane using a Heterodyne Spark item, either built by them or captured by them. There will be questions if she didn't "check in".


Shouldn't be too difficult. The librarian is already cleared with the monks and so is Franz. Lumi can just pay her fee, say she was sent by Van to look after Franz, Franz will vouch for that and the librarian can't refuse to have her tag along while she also brings along an unexpected guest. In fact, this helps her a bit since it will make it easier for her to get Franz to agree to take the monk along. Getting him to agree to give up first pick on the loot, now...

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> So, Lumi may be in a bit of trouble here, as "no one rides unshriven and unquestioned".  May give us a chance to learn more about the monk, though, based on his reaction to the new stowaway.


If, by that, you mean "borded the train in the usual way", then we have clear precident here: The monks were quite happy when Dimo borded in an unorthodox manner, as he was clearly made welcome afterwards.

Zeetha also onboarded in a slightly non-standard way, and not every traveller is expected to go through confessional.

It's likely that most of the confessional scenes are off-screen - the only one that has really been relevent to the plot was Agatha's (and that to show Brother Ulm's immediate temptation to eject her, and contextualise his actions during the arc).

----------


## Shining Wrath

Nominated as thread titles: "In Mechanicsburg, we take proper care of our monsters!" and a slightly swizzled "Pillaging and mayhem are the secrets to our success".

It seems awfully convenient that spring break lines up with this expedition. Are Lumi and Vipsania co-conspirators of cuteness?

----------


## lord_khaine

It seems a little convenient. But i dont think Vipsania is conspiring with anyone.
But i do think its possible Lumi came up with a cover story for looking after Franz.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> Nominated as thread titles: "In Mechanicsburg, we take proper care of our monsters!" and a slightly swizzled "Pillaging and mayhem are the secrets to our success".


Duly noted.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Nominated as thread titles: "In Mechanicsburg, we take proper care of our monsters!" and a slightly swizzled "Pillaging and mayhem are the secrets to our success".
> 
> It seems awfully convenient that spring break lines up with this expedition. Are Lumi and Vipsania co-conspirators of cuteness?


Lumi's lying to them. She's absolutely not here for Franz's physical. They have no way of checking whether Transylvania's Polygnostic University move its Spring break early. Hell, I wouldn't expect either of them to know when Spring break is in TPU or how long it lasts.

----------


## BRC

> Lumi's lying to them. She's absolutely not here for Franz's physical. They have no way of checking whether Transylvania's Polygnostic University move its Spring break early. Hell, I wouldn't expect either of them to know when Spring break is in TPU or how long it lasts.


Your points are valid, but I feel like the Corbettite Brotherhood specifically would be very aware of when spring break starts for TPU, since they'd bet the ones bringing students to and from the university and would need to have the capacity available.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Your points are valid, but I feel like the Corbettite Brotherhood specifically would be very aware of when spring break starts for TPU, since they'd bet the ones bringing students to and from the university and would need to have the capacity available.


I don't think there are that many students in TPU.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> I don't think there are that many students in TPU.


Counterpoint: they are likely to be problematic passengers carrying things that might go "boom", creep out of their cages and devour people, and so on. And I think the Corbettites have excellent intelligence. It might not be that every monk knows TPU's schedule, but the leaders probably do.

----------


## Radar

> Counterpoint: they are likely to be problematic passengers carrying things that might go "boom", creep out of their cages and devour people, and so on. And I think the Corbettites have excellent intelligence. It might not be that every monk knows TPU's schedule, but the leaders probably do.


Still, part about Lumi being a TPU student on a spring break might as well be true. The important lie is about the true reason of Lumi joining up for the adventure.

----------


## BRC

> Still, part about Lumi being a TPU student on a spring break might as well be true. The important lie is about the true reason of Lumi joining up for the adventure.


Similar to our librarian, I'd imagine Lumi isn't LYING about anything specifically, she's just leaving out some details. 

She probably is a TPU student studying what she says she is studying. Probably WAS offered extra credit for doing Franz's maintenance, and Vanamode Von Mekkan DID send her. 

She's lying about her full skillset and the true purpose of her visit.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Deep thought: perhaps both Vipsania and Lumi are on probation of a sort (everyone keeps dying, maybe bad grades), and will become allies of convenience to help each other succeed in (getting the book / learning about the dragon).

----------


## Grim Portent

I get the impression she's being more or less honest, but the actual reason she's here is that Van wanted her out of town. She is a pyrotech specialist after all, that implies to me she's less... subtle than her relatives and possibly inclined to make things blow up when she's bored.

Question to me is, is she a spark or just a talented and enthusiastic minion?

----------


## wingnutx

I'm guessing minion.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

Let's face it - most of Mechanicsberg, including the sparks, are minions to the Heterodynes (1, 2).

----------


## Fyraltari

> Question to me is, is she a spark or just a talented and enthusiastic minion?


You know, with how long the Van Mekkhan have served the Heterodynes, I wonder how much the two families have intermarried.

----------


## Rockphed

> Counterpoint: they are likely to be problematic passengers carrying things that might go "boom", creep out of their cages and devour people, and so on. And I think the Corbettites have excellent intelligence. It might not be that every monk knows TPU's schedule, but the leaders probably do.


Gripping point: TPU students who are especially good at blowing things up are quite likely to have their breaks "start early" because they destroyed the classroom or professor.  And their "break" might last quite a while because they need to acquire some sort of special extra credit to be readmitted. I think this is rather more lie than truth, but it is a perfect lie because the parts that can be verified are true while the rest cannot be verified at all.

----------


## wingnutx

von Mekkhan can simply tell the university "Spring break starts early this year. Right now."  and then that part of the story is true.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> von Mekkhan can simply tell the university "Spring break starts early this year. Right now."  and then that part of the story is true.


Transylvania Polygnostic University was in Beetleberg, not Mechanicsberg. I don't think Van has any say in the matter.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Hypothesis: other dragons don't destroy their lairs and everything around them. Perhaps the Iram Solis drives even dragons mad?

In which case Hydrargyros may not be dead, merely ranting in a dark corner.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

"She's got puppy eyes, telling me no lies; 
Knocking me out with those Librarian thighs!"

----------


## wingnutx

> Transylvania Polygnostic University was in Beetleberg, not Mechanicsberg. I don't think Van has any say in the matter.


Whoops. 

I wonder who is running the show there now.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Whoops. 
> 
> I wonder who is running the show there now.


Last we saw, Dr. Merlot. I bet a nickel, though, that he's been murdered by a student and replaced by someone less jerk-faced.

----------


## tyckspoon

> Last we saw, Dr. Merlot. I bet a nickel, though, that he's been murdered by a student and replaced by someone less jerk-faced.


He was sent to Der Kestle (implied to be for the damage he did destroying all the records of Beetle's work) and summarily squashed when Agatha threatened to do significant structural damage to the Castle in the course of fighting him. We do in fact not know who currently oversees the school at Beetlesburg.

----------


## Fyraltari

The Desolation of Hydrargyros doesn't quite roll off the tongue, does it?

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> Hypothesis: other dragons don't destroy their lairs and everything around them. Perhaps the Iram Solis drives even dragons mad?


Certainly an option. Another is that Hydrargyros was treated with a particular lack of respect, leading him to torch the place in retaliation.

----------


## Grim Portent

He could also have just been a ******** with an inferiority complex that decided to take it out on others when given the chance.

----------


## wingnutx

Looks like a Peter Gric painting.

----------


## Deliverance

> He was sent to Der Kestle (implied to be for the damage he did destroying all the records of Beetle's work) and summarily squashed when Agatha threatened to do significant structural damage to the Castle in the course of fighting him. We do in fact not know who currently oversees the school at Beetlesburg.


The squashing of Merlot was a memorable scene: https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20090527

----------


## eee

That she knows about the place raises suspicions of ulterior motives.




> The squashing of Merlot was a memorable scene: https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...?date=20090527


I cheered.

----------


## theangelJean

> That she knows about the place raises suspicions of ulterior motives.


Well, Franz guessed that she had already tried to get to the hoard, but couldn't - and she didn't deny it. 

Van Mekkhan knows that Vipsania's last three expeditions had no survivors except her, and he's still sending Lumi? 
I wonder what relation she is to him.

----------


## GeoffWatson

> That she knows about the place raises suspicions of ulterior motives.


It was her idea to go there - of course she knows something about it. If she didn't know anything, why go there?

----------


## Rockphed

> Well, Franz guessed that she had already tried to get to the hoard, but couldn't - and she didn't deny it. 
> 
> Van Mekkhan knows that Vipsania's last three expeditions had no survivors except her, and he's still sending Lumi? 
> I wonder what relation she is to him.


I could swear that she spelled her last name differently than Carson and Van do, but when Carson first introduces himself he uses the same spelling.  At the same time it is implied (if never outright stated) that Van is Carson's only son's only son.  I always assumed Van was Carson's only grandchild.  However, when Carson describes the attack he mentions grandchildren, not grandchild.  Lumi is probably a cousin of some sort, but she might be Van's little sister, though with how young Van is, I doubt he has a little sister (what with his father getting squished).  It is possible that Lumi is Van's aunt, but I doubt that as well (albeit for no evidence based reason).  Considering that Van still has his youthful appearance, I don't think she is his daughter.  Also, Lumi calls him "Van" not "Daddy".

----------


## Gez

"Only son's only son" does leave a lot of room for daughters and granddaughters -- and even other grandsons, since there could be like a "third daughter's fifth son" without breaking the "only son's only son" description.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> "Only son's only son" does leave a lot of room for daughters and granddaughters -- and even other grandsons, since there could be like a "third daughter's fifth son" without breaking the "only son's only son" description.


Also, history is replete with illegitimate sons who made good - William the Conqueror, IIRC, was sometimes styled "William the Bastard". I'm going to guess that a town ruled by Heterodynes may not value chastity and fidelity overmuch.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Also, history is replete with illegitimate sons who made good - William the Conqueror, IIRC, was sometimes styled "William the Bastard". I'm going to guess that a town ruled by Heterodynes may not value chastity and fidelity overmuch.


"William the Bastard" is an ahistorical nickname given by later historians with an agenda.

William (or rather Willalme) was considered perfectly legitimate by the people of his time and place, it simply happens that the Catholic Church did not recognize his parents' manner as it was "in the manner of the Danes" (meaning, among other things that papa Robert had two wives).

----------


## Shining Wrath

> "William the Bastard" is an ahistorical nickname given by later historians with an agenda.
> 
> William (or rather Willalme) was considered perfectly legitimate by the people of his time and place, it simply happens that the Catholic Church did not recognize his parents' manner as it was "in the manner of the Danes" (meaning, among other things that papa Robert had two wives).


His mother was also not titled IIRC, which might lead to the snooty considering him less worthy.
At any rate those conceived on the wrong side of the sheets still sometimes rise to prominence, and there could be some such among the von Mekkan family.

----------


## wingnutx

It may be a common local name with multiple spellings. 

Like "Rogers" versus "Rodgers", which is a small but important distinction.

----------


## Fyraltari

> It may be a common local name with multiple spellings. 
> 
> Like "Rogers" versus "Rodgers", which is a small but important distinction.


Common-born people wouldn't be allowed to use a particle in their name in the time period this is set in (and even if this is an alternate history, we see that nobility is still serious business).

----------


## BRC

The Von Mekkans don't seem to follow the model of nobility, they're favored servants to a family of mad warlords rather than aristocracy. 

Still, there are plenty of places Lumi could have come from. Carson may have had only one son and grandson, but he could have had siblings or cousins with children of their own. The Von Mekkans are one of the leading families of Mechanisburg, along with the Blood Circle, they're not going to be limited to a single line. 

Heck, for all we know some heterodyne cloned their Seneschal a while back to have backups, and we've got 3 or 4 independent "Von Mekkan" families running around.

----------


## Fyraltari

> The Von Mekkans don't seem to follow the model of nobility, they're favored servants to a family of mad warlords rather than aristocracy.


So? Nobility in service to higher nobility is kind of the idea. Being a seneschal is a big deal and the von Mekkhan are the ones who essentially run Mechanigsburg whenever the Heterodyne is busy mad sciencing which is pretty much always. Case in point.

----------


## BRC

> So? Nobility in service to higher nobility is kind of the idea. Being a seneschal is a big deal and the von Mekkhan are the ones who essentially run Mechanigsburg whenever the Heterodyne is busy mad sciencing which is pretty much always. Case in point.


I'm not saying they're not IMPORTANT, they are, and probably wield more effective power than plenty of traditional landholding aristocrats. 

But they point is their position, no matter how powerful, is one of service rather than ownership, the Seneschal is the head of the family, but all things considered I kind of doubt that the Seneschal must be determined by anything as straightforward as Primogeniture. 

Although the only examples of succession we have consist of a fairly straightforward line of Father-> Son (Son dies) -> Father -> Grandson.

----------


## Fyraltari

> I'm not saying they're not IMPORTANT, they are, and probably wield more effective power than plenty of traditional landholding aristocrats. 
> 
> But they point is their position, no matter how powerful, is one of service rather than ownership


Yes. Girl Genius is set somewhen in the XIXth century. This is normal. Lesser nobility being in service to higher nobility is the way the system work.

Like I said upthread, it's in the name: von Makkan, Mechanigsburg.



> the Seneschal is the head of the family, but all things considered I kind of doubt that the Seneschal must be determined by anything as straightforward as Primogeniture.
> 
> Although the only examples of succession we have consist of a fairly straightforward line of Father-> Son (Son dies) -> Father -> Grandson.


Pretty sure the position is hereditary. At the very least, their cover job is.

----------


## BRC

rolling back a bit from the ones you linked, Klaus believing the Seneschal's were gone because of some records about the death of one man seems like a pretty solid indication that the line is a fairly straightforward hereditary lineage. 
https://www.girlgeniusonline.com/com...0#.Y3adXH3MKUk

Presumably, just like any other noble family, if there is no immediately available heir for the post some other relative can be found and a new "Primary" line descends from them, but when no Schenescal stepped forwards, it seems like Klaus found it easier to appoint a council of civic leaders (Plus I think a Burgermeister is mentioned at some point) rather than try to track down the Von Mekkan's and pick one of them as the heir. 

Besides, the Von Mekkans run things in the name of the Heterodynes. I'm sure they've run the town in the past when there was no Heterodyne, but having the "Schenescal of the Heterodynes" publicly in charge seems like a bad move from a respect-for-the-baron standpoint, a reminder that he only rules the town for now. Much cleaner to appoint a burgermeister and treat it like any other Imperial holding that didn't have an available aristocrat. 

It wouldn't surprise me if Klaus knew that the Von Mekkan's were actually running things, but he didn't actually care.


Edit: Yeah, a Burgermeister Zuken. Unknown if Klaus created the position when he took over, or if Mechanisburg has always had a Burgermeister who helps take the load of the Schenescal.

The Seneschal would, IIRC, be in charge of running the heterodyne's Household, the castle, as well as running the town on behalf of the masters, plus being a chief minion. 

Wouldn't surprise me if the town had a Burgermeister (Runs day-to-day administration of boring town stuff on behalf of the Seneschal), plus some equivalent within the Castle? 

Or Klaus whipped up the office. Either works.

----------


## lord_khaine

Isnt the von (something) partly a noble title?
Or something in that regard?

----------


## BRC

> Isnt the von (something) partly a noble title?
> Or something in that regard?


In the real world, yes usually. 

In GG-verse? possibly. Our first Von is Moloch Von Zinzer, who is about as dirt-common as you can get, being a grunt soldier. 

Meanwhile, the Nobliest Noble we've met, Tarvek Sturmvoraus, doesn't carry a "Von", but his cousin Martellus Von Blitzengard, does. Klaus doesn't use Von, but he's only a Baron, the lowest level of nobility. 

So it's possible that the Foglio's only thought to start Voning their nobles partway through the story, and before then just sprinkled Vons in randomly.

Or in the GGverse "Von" doesn't mean much.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Isnt the von (something) partly a noble title?
> Or something in that regard?


Yes, that's the particle I alluded to.



> In the real world, yes usually. 
> 
> In GG-verse? possibly. Our first Von is Moloch Von Zinzer, who is about as dirt-common as you can get, being a grunt soldier.


Oh, that's a good point.




> Meanwhile, the Nobliest Noble we've met, Tarvek Sturmvoraus, doesn't carry a "Von", but his cousin Martellus Von Blitzengard, does.


Which is funny since they're competing over the legacy of a French guy.



> Klaus doesn't use Von, but he's only a Baron, the lowest level of nobility.


Doesn't matter.

----------


## BRC

A quick googling tells me that "Von" can be used to indicate nobility, but can also be a commoner surname meaning "of" or "From" (Like how Leonardo DaVinci's name translates to "Leonardo from Vinci") from before surnames became a thing for commoners.  Von Zinzer probably had an ancestor from a place called Zinzer about when Surnames started becoming a thing. 

It looks like historically there's only been a correlation between "Von" being nobility. Commoner vons and noble non-vons were both common enough. 

In the case of the Von Mekkan's, it could be either. The Heterodynes founded the town in ancient times, but it's entirely possible that their favored servants picked up an aristocratic naming scheme to reflect their station as, basically, the rulers of Mechanisburg (Since The Masters were rarely interested in anything so provincial as government). 

It's also possible that "Von Mekkan" came from the commoner origins, "I'm Guy from Place". 

From Wikipedia, it looks like there are three possible origins

1) An aristocratic landholding family. Guy von Place meaning "I'm lord Guy, ruler of Place"

2) A commoner toponym "I'm Guy from Place"

3) A family elevated to nobility sticks a "Von" in their name. Guy von Surname meaning "My family were the Surnames, and when we became counts we became the Von Surnames". 

Options 1 or 2 are both perfectly possible for the Von Mekkans. 

Apparently at some point it became fashionable to differentiate noble and non-noble Vons by abbreviating noble ones to v. Martellius v. Blitzengarrd vs Moloch Von Zinzer. 

or combining the Von into a non-noble surname. Moloch Vonzinzer. 


(Also, fun fact related to this, Joan of arc was not, in fact, "Joan Of Arc", there is no place named Arc for her to be of or from. When she lived surnames were not universal and spelling was inconsistent, her father's surname was probably best translated as "Darc", IIRC after her death when surnames were becoming standardized a lot of french surnames starting with D were given an apostrophe, turning them into d'place. This lead to the name "Joan of Arc")

----------


## eee

"Transformers, more than meets the eye, Transformers!"

I'm actually rather pleased about this...

----------


## Shining Wrath

Monk suspicious level drops. Humongulous is not on the side of evil.

----------


## The Glyphstone

However, Humungulous is also a bit dim and easily tricked up to the point he's actually told to *do* something evil.

----------


## Kareasint

This is turning into a weird adventuring party. The carrying capacity just increased.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> However, Humungulous is also a bit dim and easily tricked up to the point he's actually told to *do* something evil.


Yes, but getting Humungulous assigned to you by the Order probably means being a monk in good standing, and the Corborittes are not overtly evil.




> This is turning into a weird adventuring party. The carrying capacity just increased.


Humungulous is a mule that can fight. This actually makes a stand-up fight with a dragon less likely; the dungeon will probably not feature many problems that can be solved by punching things.

----------


## Zazu Yen

Ah, Chekhov's Humungulous.

----------


## tyckspoon

> Ah, Chekhov's Humungulous.


"If you place a giant mechanical gymbro in a trainyard in the first act, it must lift something in the third."

----------


## Rockphed

> "Only son's only son" does leave a lot of room for daughters and granddaughters -- and even other grandsons, since there could be like a "third daughter's fifth son" without breaking the "only son's only son" description.


The real problem is that it gets hard for her to have the "Von Mekkan" surname in that situation.  I share a birth surname with almost all of my cousins: my mother's siblings never had children but my father's sister's children have a different surname (my name is common enough that not everyone who wears it is related to me, but not common enough that there was ever a high chance that a female relative would retain it.

It is possible that she was born to one of Carson's adventurous daughters without the father being in the picture (one of my nephews was born about the same time as his mother's divorce from who they call "the biology donor" (I've never met the guy so I cannot state how charitable they are being with that appellation) and he bears my wife's maiden name).

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> I could swear that she spelled her last name differently than Carson and Van do, but when Carson first introduces himself he uses the same spelling.  At the same time it is implied (if never outright stated) that Van is Carson's only son's only son.  I always assumed Van was Carson's only grandchild.  However, when Carson describes the attack he mentions grandchildren, not grandchild.  Lumi is probably a cousin of some sort, but she might be Van's little sister, though with how young Van is, I doubt he has a little sister (what with his father getting squished).


What about her being Van's twin sister? Sure, she wasn't shown before, but tbh there wasn't much reason to...

----------


## PraetorDragoon

"Homungulus is here to lift and punch things" is a nice potential thread title.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Fyraltari

> What about her being Van's twin sister? Sure, she wasn't shown before, but tbh there wasn't much reason to...


Why twin? She seems younger to me.

----------


## Shining Wrath

While we're discussing the clan lineage of Von Mekkan, I'm sure adoptions happen from time to time. Lumi doesn't look like Van. Or she may be married into the family.

----------


## The Glyphstone

And all this is just assuming normal, historical methods of being part of a family. In a world of *SCIENCE!!!*, the options expand significantly with regards to genetics/lineage/etc.

----------


## Rockphed

> Why twin? She seems younger to me.


On the one hand there was a time stop that messed up lots of people's personal chronology.  On the other hand, I think Van seemed to be about 25 when we first meet him while Lumi seems to be 17 - 19.  He might have been as young as 18 when we first met him, though that would be a bit of a stretch with other chronology that we know (i.e. Agatha is about 18 and was born 9 months - 3 years after the attack on Castle Heterodyne).

On the gripping hand Lumi has not had the weight of the town on her shoulders almost from when she could talk.  I imagine that Van has had a certain amount of premature aging and maturing due to running the town.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> On the one hand there was a time stop that messed up lots of people's personal chronology.  On the other hand, I think Van seemed to be about 25 when we first meet him while Lumi seems to be 17 - 19.  He might have been as young as 18 when we first met him, though that would be a bit of a stretch with other chronology that we know (i.e. Agatha is about 18 and was born 9 months - 3 years after the attack on Castle Heterodyne).


Klaus mentions Der Kestle was attacked nineteen years ago. Considering Carson's flashback, I'd put Van as being a year old at the time at most, making him ~20 when the story starts.




> Why twin? She seems younger to me.


Because that was one option not mentioned by Rockphed.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Klaus mentions Der Kestle was attacked nineteen years ago. Considering Carson's flashback, I'd put Van as being a year old at the time at most, making him ~20 when the story starts.


How do you know that baby is van and not Lumi or any other grandchild?





> Because that was one option not mentioned by Rockphed.


Fair.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> How do you know that baby is van and not Lumi or any other grandchild?


Ockham's razor - Van is the only grandchild we knew of at that point (well, at this point as well I guess). Plus the hair reminds me of his color scheme (granted, the image is quite small).

----------


## Fyraltari

> Ockham's razor - Van is the only grandchild we knew of at that point.


No, he's not? The narration box in that very panel says grandchild*ren*.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> "Homungulus is here to lift and punch things" is a nice potential thread title.


Duly noted.

----------


## Fyraltari

Indeed, some things _never_ change:



> You can say _Expert Treasure-hunter_ instead of _Burglar_ if you like. Some of them do. It's all the same to us.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Expert Treasure Hunter _unofficially_ visits dragon's lair.

Also, with time travel a thing, Lumi could be a Von Mekkan from the past, the future, or Van from an alternate timeline where he was born the other gender.

I think we are perhaps putting too much thought into Lumi's ancestry. This is my shocked face.

----------


## Divayth Fyr

> No, he's not? The narration box in that very panel says grandchild*ren*.


Fine, I'll spell it out fully - the only grandchild we specifically know of, instead of just hearing there should be some others around; ie we have a name, and meet him. Contrast with any (potential) others, whose existance we base on a single line.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Fine, I'll spell it out fully - the only grandchild we specifically know of, instead of just hearing there should be some others around; ie we have a name, and meet him. Contrast with any (potential) others, whose existance we base on a single line.


This has nothing to do with Occam's razor, though. Since we already know Carson had several grandchildren to play with, the notion that the baby isn't the one grandchild whose name we know doesn't require any additional hypothesis.

----------


## wingnutx

> I'm guessing minion.



WRONG AGAIN!

Now we know.

----------


## Rockphed

I hope we don't get Humongulus fatigue.  He is a pretty awesome character, but he is very much a single note character.  It is a good note (and has been used with humor and skill up to now), but I can see getting tired of his gymbro attitude if we see too much of it at once.

----------


## TeChameleon

> I hope we don't get Humongulus fatigue.  He is a pretty awesome character, but he is very much a single note character.  It is a good note (and has been used with humor and skill up to now), but I can see getting tired of his gymbro attitude if we see too much of it at once.


Well, the most recent page (where Franz compares the group to a classic adventuring party) hints at... well, if nothing else, greater self-awareness than we would have necessarily expected from Humongulous ("Is... is this one of those times when Humongulous is the joke?"), along with an unexpectedly sensitive side.  So I guess we'll see.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Humongulous has a purpose!

"Beware" seems to scare Vipsania, but Franz is suspicious.

----------


## theangelJean

Is Vipsania's "sleep" comment referring to anything other than the "sitting on the loot" bit? I don't think Franz was deliberately manipulating Humungulous in this strip, so what would she be trying to guilt trip him for?

----------


## wingnutx

> I don't think Franz was deliberately manipulating Humungulous in this strip


He is prodding him to volunteer to carry everything.  I wouldn't call it manipulation, since H loves to do it, but Vipsania seems to think it is.

----------


## Radar

> He is prodding him to volunteer to carry everything.  I wouldn't call it manipulation, since H loves to do it, but Vipsania seems to think it is.


He kind of reminds me of Helix in that regard.

----------


## Zazu Yen

> "If you place a giant mechanical gymbro in a trainyard in the first act, it must lift something in the third."


Chekhov's Humungulous is about to LYFT!

----------


## lord_khaine

> He is prodding him to volunteer to carry everything. I wouldn't call it manipulation, since H loves to do it, but Vipsania seems to think it is.


He isnt prodding anyone.
He is giving Humongulus an excuse/invitation, to do the thing Humongulus likes.

----------


## The Glyphstone

That it also lets Franz be lazy just makes it a win-win for everyone.

----------


## theangelJean

> He isnt prodding anyone.
> He is giving Humongulus an excuse/invitation, to do the thing Humongulus likes.





> That it also lets Franz be lazy just makes it a win-win for everyone.


See, I thought it wasn't directed at Humungulous at all, just a general all-purpose grumble, continuing on from two strips ago before he even knew Humungulous was coming with them.

If it was actually intentional, then Franz is doing a good job of "leadership through passive-aggressive whining". He didn't assign himself a role after all ... 

Although he is comparing this to previous experience of being The Dragon. Wonder if he intends to fight them all?

----------


## Traab

Nice, this feels like a D&D campaign. Here comes the mystery big bad making his opening speech, only for the barbarian to charge and one shot him with a lucky series of crits and flip the train right off the tracks it was supposed to go on.

----------


## Radar

> Nice, this feels like a D&D campaign. Here comes the mystery big bad making his opening speech, only for the barbarian to charge and one shot him with a lucky series of crits and flip the train right off the tracks it was supposed to go on.


Crazy, but that's how things go.  :Small Wink: 

Let's only hope they will not split the party, because this is often even more of a headache than just a derailed adventure.

----------


## lord_khaine

That comic was kinda funny :D

----------


## Squire Doodad

> Nice, this feels like a D&D campaign. Here comes the mystery big bad making his opening speech, only for the barbarian to charge and one shot him with a lucky series of crits and flip the train right off the tracks it was supposed to go on.


I think this was more one of the few survivors stationing themselves there to keep unwary travelers away.

Unrelated, I must say - so far this is probably my second favorite of the intermission stories, just behind the shrink ray with the Castle of Blue Mice. Snakkerjape and the Christmas Story were both rather good, though I did find Private Jager to be...less captivating than what's around it, if not an enjoyable story of its own.

----------


## otakuryoga

but what about the BIG QUESTION?

*IS HIS STUFF OK?*

----------


## Shining Wrath

Mysterious robed figure has vanished!
Hypothesises:
Mysterious Robed Figure was never there, and the cries of pain were fakedMysterious Robed Figure was tough enough to "walk it off" after Humongulous delivered a crushing blowMysterious Robed Figure has friends who extracted them from beneath Franz's stuffMysterious Robed Figure died and vaporized / turned to ichor / otherwise departed the scene

And it does seem that most of Franz's stuff is still intact, so ... yay?

----------


## eee

Franz is marvelously pragmatic.

----------


## Onyavar

Sorry for the snark on the spark, but how do they tuck their hair behind their eyelashes?

This is anatomically impossible, unless you're a biology major apparently.

----------


## Rockphed

> Sorry for the snark on the spark, but how do they tuck their hair behind their eyelashes?
> 
> This is anatomically impossible, unless you're a biology major apparently.


If I were trying to give a physical explanation, it would probably involve hair swoopies (especially blonde ones) being less opaque than they are shown to be, especially at their margins.  You can also see her eyebrow on top of her hair which is even less anatomically possible.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

She's a spark. They're artificial lashes and they also pick up Radio Free Paris.

----------


## Fyraltari

She learned from Gandalf.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I wonder how often Humongulous panics and has to apologize afterward? This might be a routine event for him.

Franz has a dragon's attitude toward danger - which is, there are very few things that are actually dangerous to a dragon. Lumi and Vispania are understandably a little less sanguine.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Now I'm wondering what the Corbettite definition for ghost is, and how it differs from the Mechanicsburg term.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## BRC

> Now I'm wondering what the Corbettite definition for ghost is, and how it differs from the Mechanicsburg term.


Probably some abominable device they have in their vaults

"Ghosts" as in "Vengeful spirits of the Dead" are not real, but the late Karl Skazzgatter's Discorporation Beam, which slightly phases people out of reality trapping them in a state of perpetual rage and only occasional corporeality is very, very real, and the end result is pretty indistinguishable.

----------


## eee

> I wonder how often Humongulous panics and has to apologize afterward? This might be a routine event for him.
> 
> <snip>


Maybe.  Maybe not.  Throwing crates and barrels of supplies at someone just for screaming "Bewaaare!" strikes me as excessive.  Maybe they should ask Humongulus what he saw; his clank eyes may have seen something other than what dragon or human eyes did.

----------


## theangelJean

New comic. I know it's a plot contrivance here, but we haven't seen the "absent-minded" side of Spark obsession for a while. Gotta love it.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> New comic. I know it's a plot contrivance here, but we haven't seen the "absent-minded" side of Spark obsession for a while. Gotta love it.


And I, too, would panic if I were a hundred kilometers from coffee.

----------


## Radar

> New comic. I know it's a plot contrivance here, but we haven't seen the "absent-minded" side of Spark obsession for a while. Gotta love it.


I cannot say it is much of a contrivance. Missing the obvious happens to a lot of people. Take this case for example.

As for realizing there will be no coffee in the foreseeable future, it kind of also happens. Some people from (for example) USA get really surprised when abroad that you can travel a long way through a city and not find a single McDonalds or other popular food or coffee place.

It is really funny though.  :Small Smile: 

For me the best scene with this kind of tunnel vision was with the infamous falling machine, when Agatha and Gil started to redesign the engine literally on the fly.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

A classic student AND rpg problem.  :Small Big Grin:

----------


## Shining Wrath

Prediction: Humongulous will find something important while digging. Chekov's shovel is about to be fired.

Also, don't you think that finding out about Vispania's prior journey would have been useful before arriving in a blasted wasteland?

----------


## PraetorDragoon

When would they had time to listen to the story?  :Small Big Grin: 

Homungulus has his priorities in order.

----------


## Rockphed

I like the implication that Franz doesn't intend to share treasure.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> When would they had time to listen to the story? 
> 
> Homungulus has his priorities in order.


Franz, before leaving Mechanicsburg.
The monk, during negotiations for the book prior to Vipsania entering Mechanicsburg.
You got me on Lumi.

----------


## Kantaki

Okay, so she isn't officially banned from missions, but no one will take her because best case she's a walking bad luck charm.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Okay, so she isn't officially banned from missions, but no one will take her because best case she's a walking bad luck charm.


Do you think the smoke Knights also do shadow-banning?

----------


## Shining Wrath

Thread title: "Bears, a weak staircase, and then ... more bears".

----------


## wingnutx

> Thread title: "Bears, a weak staircase, and then ... more bears".


That's a strong contender.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

> Thread title: "Bears, a weak staircase, and then ... more bears".


Duly noted. You are currently leading in the "number of titles suggested" stakes.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

> Do you think the smoke Knights also do shadow-banning?


Considering they work in the shadows, I think they do light-banning.

----------


## Radar

> Considering they work in the shadows, I think they do light-banning.


Not sure if this is right as a ban can weight heavily upon a person.

----------


## otakuryoga

Humongulus! No!!
don't throw anything more!

----------


## Shining Wrath

Does anyone else suspect the mysterious figure is the freelancer? Who may be from the family of the Spark who created the Idram Solis.

Also, *excellent* dramatic entrance. And Vipsania looks like a lantern fish in panel 4.

----------


## Kantaki

> Does anyone else suspect the mysterious figure is the freelancer? Who may be from the family of the Spark who created the Idram Solis.
> 
> Also, *excellent* dramatic entrance. And Vipsania looks like a lantern fish in panel 4.


I suspect so.

But if he isn't I'm upgrading Vipsania from "bad luck charm" to "death curse". :Small Amused: 

Also, that angler fish look is definitely deliberate.
I mean, I can see why the librarians would use those lamps in universe, but  it's a suspicious look on a already suspect character.

----------


## Scarlet Knight

> Does anyone else suspect the mysterious figure is the freelancer? Who may be from the family of the Spark who created the Idram Solis.
> 
> Also, *excellent* dramatic entrance. And Vipsania looks like a lantern fish in panel 4.


Since Aldin appeared earlier, I assume the new Phantom is Jiminez.

----------


## wingnutx

I can do with some more Jiminez.

----------


## geoduck

> I can do with some more Jiminez.


That would be kind of sad, actually, if he's hanging out in this blighted wasteland instead of having adventures with his wife. 

Othar is another possibility, though again I sort of hope not.

----------


## Shining Wrath

We've seen Othar recently, meeting Gil and Tarvek. Plus he would introduce himself, modesty being his void suit.

It's not anyone from the library, but it may be someone from one of the other deep realms.

----------


## Kantaki

New comic

Sorry, buddy, but you aren't very convincing.
Sure, there's a bit of a sliding scale involved, particularly if things get sparky, but you better deliver some incredible evidence to make that claim believable.

----------


## theangelJean

He could be a head and a cloak. Would explain his escape.

----------


## Shining Wrath

Hector looks pretty good for dead. And Vipsania didn't just think of him as a hired gun.
Now, we know that the Baron was able to revive dead people in his lab, so I imagine we're about to learn there's some powerful Spark about who fixed Hector up after his untimely demise.

----------


## Fyraltari

I mean, it's either Sparky shenanigans, tax evasion, or an acute case of Cotard's syndrom.

----------


## wingnutx

He's only mostly dead. 

Revived, probably.

----------


## Rodin

He wouldn't be the first "already dead" character in the comic.  The mad social scientist dude has been brought back from the dead repeatedly and considers himself an undead abomination of science (in the best possible way, of course).

----------


## Shining Wrath

In the classic D&D party, Hector is the barbarian. The really, really dumb barbarian.
Unsure about Foglio scale, but his head is way bigger than the cleric's or Vip's. He may in fact be a really big person.

----------


## Kantaki

Ah yes, he isn't dead. Just stupid. I guess that explains why he agreed to work with Miss Bad Luck Charm. :Small Big Grin:

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Now I wonder who told him he is a ghost. Or maybe its a "conclusion" he did draw himself?  :Small Big Grin: 

"Let us put violence aside.. for now" has a nice ring to it.

----------


## Shining Wrath

> Now I wonder who told him he is a ghost. Or maybe its a "conclusion" he did draw himself? 
> 
> "Let us put violence aside.. for now" has a nice ring to it.


"It costs you nothing to be polite to a man until you kill him" - WLS Churchill, with what may be the most British quote in history.

----------


## St Fan

> Ah yes, he isn't dead. Just stupid.


Which makes him way scarier, no?

----------


## Kantaki

> Which makes him way scarier, no?


Let me put it this way, one of those conditions doesn't disqualify him from being trusted near anything dangerous.
And it's not the low int-score. :Small Big Grin:

----------


## eee

Being a ghost is dangerous work.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I'm doubting Lumi's intelligence at this moment as well. But she's not dead.
Hector may now wish he was dead, though.

----------


## TeChameleon

> I'm doubting Lumi's intelligence at this moment as well. But she's not dead.
> Hector may now wish he was dead, though.


Don't forget, Lumi is a spark, and sparky intelligence tends to be... selective.  She's also in the throes of caffeine withdrawal, which I suspect is interfering with her critical thinking skills as well, although sparky critical thinking tends to be iffy at the best of times.

----------


## Rockphed

This is rapidly turning into a "how much physical comedy can we extract out of the idiot" plot, which is delightful.

----------


## Fyraltari

> This is rapidly turning into a "how much physical comedy can we extract out of the idiot" plot, which is delightful.


But Gil isn't even here!

----------


## Rockphed

> But Gil isn't even here!


Be gone Targatha supporter!  Agamesh is the OTP! :Small Tongue: 

In seriousness, I cannot actually think of a time when we got a slew of physical jokes with Gil as the butt of them.

----------


## Fyraltari

> Be gone Targatha supporter!  Agamesh is the OTP!


Oh please, my money is on either both or none.




> In seriousness, I cannot actually think of a time when we got a slew of physical jokes with Gil as the butt of them.


Heh, I kind of picked him at random, slapstick is kind of universal in this comic. I will admit that he wasn't the best choice (not that he's immune, mind), I should have gone with Othar or Von Zinzer.

----------


## Rockphed

> Oh please, my money is on either both or none.
> 
> 
> 
> Heh, I kind of picked him at random, slapstick is kind of universal in this comic. I will admit that he wasn't the best choice (not that he's immune, mind), I should have gone with Othar or Von Zinzer.


Til gets to be the butt of social jokes all the time, he just seldom has his face serve as the punchline. I think von zinzer is the main cast member who our ghost most reminds me of (albeit with Higgs's face).

----------


## Shining Wrath

I vote Othar for king of physical comedy. "No fair!".

----------


## geoduck

> I vote Othar for king of physical comedy. "No fair!".


"Foul!" to be more precise.

----------


## theangelJean

In today's new comic, Hector displays an unusual ability. 

I would wonder if there was a simple explanation ... But I think we would be told if they belonged to someone in the party.

----------


## TeChameleon

... "Scorthmaw"?  Typo or speech impediment?

----------


## lord_khaine

Possibly accent?

----------


## sihnfahl

> ... "Scorthmaw"?  Typo or speech impediment?


Knowing previous issues, typo.

----------


## Shining Wrath

We have a villain! A disembodied Professor of malign intent!
And Hector is too dumb to know he's being used by the bad guy.

----------


## sihnfahl

> And Hector is too dumb to know he's being used by the bad guy.


Or he knows and is Obfuscating Stupidity.

----------


## geoduck

> We have a villain! A disembodied Professor of malign intent!
> And Hector is too dumb to know he's being used by the bad guy.


That might actually be his body. Though yeah, it's probably a communicator of some sort.

----------


## TeChameleon

> Knowing previous issues, typo.


True, but on the other hand, I actually went back and checked the rest of the mysterious professor's speech, and that was the only instance of a 'ch' sound (well, a replaced/typo-ed 'ch' sound), so it's tough to tell at this point.

----------


## Shining Wrath

I thought the Professor was inside the box; that's all that's left of them after some unfortunate Spark event.

We now find that Humongulous is an intellectual with little intellect. He thinks a lot, but alas, the CPU power is insufficient to draw deep conclusions.

----------


## Erik the Green

Perhaps someone should introduce Humongulous to the Royal Society For Putting Things on Top of Other Things, if it exists in Albia's England. A very fulfilling pursuit, or so I'm told ;)

----------


## hajo

Helix from Freefall is much smaller than Humongulous, but seems to be more well-rounded, 
both in capabilities and appearance   :Small Tongue:

----------


## Rockphed

> Helix from Freefall is much smaller than Humongulous, but seems to be more well-rounded, 
> both in capabilities and appearance


And they both enjoy spending time with nonhuman creatures who enjoy gaining wealth.

I also thought of helix when I read this comic.

----------


## Manga Shoggoth

It occurs to me that the hillock that Vip and her cat are crossing in panel 1 looks remarkably like a somewhat inactive dragon (or dinosaur) construct.

----------


## Radar

> It occurs to me that the hillock that Vip and her cat are crossing in panel 1 looks remarkably like a somewhat inactive dragon (or dinosaur) construct.


It does indeed - quite a big one at that.

----------


## PraetorDragoon

Either that is a rare clank-eating worm or that worm will have some stomach issues soon.

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## theangelJean

What kind of creature looks at the party and thinks "okay, which one will I devour? Oh, I know, the polished metal one!"

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## Radar

> What kind of creature looks at the party and thinks "okay, which one will I devour? Oh, I know, the polished metal one!"


I would assume the creature grabbed whoever was the heaviest - it came from the ground, so was probably picking the target depending on the *thump!* the footsteps made. Also, you assume that creature is capable of reasoning.

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## Manga Shoggoth

> What kind of creature looks at the party and thinks "okay, which one will I devour? Oh, I know, the polished metal one!"


This kind?

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## Shining Wrath

I surmise that a creature of that size attacked the largest target. Lumi, Vip, Kliban, and Marcus (did we just learn his name?) are not even appetizers.

It also got Franz's supplies, which include a fair amount of meat.

Ah, the monstrous Purple Worm, a D&D standby since 2nd edition. Does this one have a venomous stinger?

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## InvisibleBison

I don't think there's any reason to assume the creature is looking for food. It's obviously a construct, so it could have any sort of weird "instincts" programmed into it by its creator, not to mention the possibility that it's still under someone's command.

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## Kantaki

Maybe the worm is some kind of (artificial obviously) scavenger. Just for metals instead of biomatter.

I mean, there's a lot of scrap metal lying around.
Some Spark deciding to create something that recycles/refines that stuff for them to use wouldn't be surprising.

That it ate Humongulous is probably a unlucky coincidence. For the worm.
Especially if Franz's stuff gets damaged.

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## Gez

I'm going to guess it just chose the largest target out of gluttony.

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## PraetorDragoon

> Ah, the monstrous Purple Worm, a D&D standby since 2nd edition. Does this one have a venomous stinger?


Knowing sparks, I'm erring to "yes".

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## Shining Wrath

Looking at the eyes, I call this creature biological, not mechanical. It's not a clank.
Given Sparks, that does not imply at all that it's natural. Just carbon-based.
As for the poisonous stinger, that's very 18th century; why not a good death ray?

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## Kantaki

New comic 

Of course there's more of those things.
Now are we dealing with the kind of idiot Spark that created a whole bunch of those things or the kind of idiot Spark that made them able to breed*? 

And in typical Spark fashion the death ray is a kitchen tool.
Somehow I don't want to eat any food prepared with that thing. Mostly because I might not like it and the cook'd have a frigging death ray. :Small Amused: 

But good luck getting that cat back. It's almost like Vip has no idea what she's doing.

*I say that, but my biggest disappointment in _Let's build a Zoo_ is that the hybrids can't breed. :Small Big Grin:

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## Manga Shoggoth

> But good luck getting that cat back. It's almost like Vip has no idea what she's doing.


To be fair, that's a state of being not uncommon amongst the younger characters in the story. And the older ones. And sparks in general.

Besides, it's a cat. When did you last see a cat doing what you wanted it to do? Actually, the cat is probably the opnly one taking a sensible position here.

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## PraetorDragoon

> And in typical Spark fashion the death ray is a kitchen tool.
> Somehow I don't want to eat any food prepared with that thing. Mostly because I might not like it and the cook'd have a frigging death ray.


Just imagine the Flambé you could make with it.

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## Kantaki

> Just imagine the Flambé you could make with it.


I guess you could flambé a lot of people with that stick. :Small Eek: 
Er, I mean _for_ a lot of people. :Small Tongue:

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## PraetorDragoon

> I guess you could flambé a lot of people with that stick.
> Er, I mean _for_ a lot of people.


A lot of people for a lot of people!  :Small Big Grin:

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## Shining Wrath

So Vipsania has a mouse in her pocket, suggesting that Kliban runs away routinely, but didn't think to have any of the essential items (like Ash Worm repellant) on her person? I begin to see why her adventuring parties die a lot.

I wonder if the evil Professor will save the party in order to save the dragon that he needs to get to the treasure?

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## lord_khaine

Eh. Very clearly Kliban has a lot of things that are situationally important, but generally useless.
Such as ash worm repellent in assumed non-ashworm land.

So i think its reasonable that the thing she actually carries, is the thing that draw her cat to her.

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## Gez

> Besides, it's a cat. When did you last see a cat doing what you wanted it to do?


Well, I want my cat to be cute and cuddly and to purr a lot, and she accomplishes those tasks with flawless brio every day.  :Small Smile:

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## Shining Wrath

Cat climbing tallest thing in vicinity = normal.
Tallest thing in vicinity being a person = not so normal but I've seen it happen.
Worm repellant being an obnoxious noise = unexpected, and when the worms leave what will come to investigate the obnoxious noise? Exit frying pan, enter fire.

Question: what's the recharge on Franz's breath weapon?

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## Kantaki

> Question: what's the recharge on Franz's breath weapon?


Just long enough to be (in)convenient.
It recharges at the speed of plot. :Small Tongue:

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## eee

Well, that would certainly repel me.

The monk needs to pull his weight more in combat.

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## PraetorDragoon

> Well, that would certainly repel me.
> 
> The monk needs to pull his weight more in combat.


Contractually, this Cleric only needs to pull 5% of his weight.  :Small Big Grin:

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## Shining Wrath

Hector has Sparky Bagpipes. Nothing good can come of this.

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## Divayth Fyr

My first thought was that he already did use them, and that caused the eel attack. Possibly targetted at Humongulus, to remove the (potentially) biggest obstacle for his master's plan.

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## sihnfahl

> My first thought was that he already did use them, and that caused the eel attack. Possibly targetted at Humongulus, to remove the (potentially) biggest obstacle for his master's plan.


And my thought is that he knows the sound repels them and he's shadowing the group because his master told him to keep them alive.  With the smaller device at ground zero, they probably couldn't tell the louder sound came from somewhere else.

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## Shining Wrath

> And my thought is that he knows the sound repels them and he's shadowing the group because his master told him to keep them alive.  With the smaller device at ground zero, they probably couldn't tell the louder sound came from somewhere else.


This makes sense, and explains why Vipsania was surprised.

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## Manga Shoggoth

Candidate thread title: Girl Genius XXXI: Many fine things can be found inside monsters

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## theangelJean

For anyone who was worried about Humongulus overload... He's becoming pleasingly multifaceted.

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## Fyraltari

> For anyone who was worried about Humongulus overload... He's becoming pleasingly multifaceted.


Humongulus is never overloaded! He is well aware of his lifting capacities and will divide the load accordingly if the need ever arise!

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## Shining Wrath

Possible thread title (slightly modified from strip): "I see many things. Usually, no one wants to hear about them."

This is one of those "It's a comic, suspend disbelief" moments. The monsters can find the party, but don't notice Hector at all, so he's always able to help them.

Admittedly I think Humongulous probably has disadvantage on Stealth Checks, but still, you'd think that Hector would occasionally be in the wrong place at the wrong time.

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## The Glyphstone

Or maybe he/his master have a way to conceal themselves from said monsters?

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## InvisibleBison

> This is one of those "It's a comic, suspend disbelief" moments. The monsters can find the party, but don't notice Hector at all, so he's always able to help them.
> 
> Admittedly I think Humongulous probably has disadvantage on Stealth Checks, but still, you'd think that Hector would occasionally be in the wrong place at the wrong time.


I see no reason to think Hector is going unnoticed by monsters. He just has the necessary equipment to deal with them when they do notice him.

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## Grim Portent

Clearly the monsters don't attack him because he's a ghost.

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## eee

> Clearly the monsters don't attack him because he's a ghost.


If he's walking around and not being attacked, that might be why he thinks he's a ghost.

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## BRC

An obvious answer to "Why more monsters" is a bigger party that includes Franz and Humungolus 

But my guess is that this "Professor" Hector works for has been stirring things up with his attempts to get to the Hoard.

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## Shining Wrath

We're being told that things are really tough, that everyone is fighting / avoiding traps almost constant (except Lumi?), and Hector is helping out, because the Professor wants the dragon to reach the destination. I don't think Hector / Professor are both causing the problems and then solving them, so the monsters and traps are not under their control.

So ... why does Hector never step into a hole he can't climb out of? Never see a monster he's not equipped to fight? It's not like he's the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.

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## Traab

> We're being told that things are really tough, that everyone is fighting / avoiding traps almost constant (except Lumi?), and Hector is helping out, because the Professor wants the dragon to reach the destination. I don't think Hector / Professor are both causing the problems and then solving them, so the monsters and traps are not under their control.
> 
> So ... why does Hector never step into a hole he can't climb out of? Never see a monster he's not equipped to fight? It's not like he's the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.


Well he likely already knows what monsters are in the area as he has been here awhile. So being prepared makes sense. As for never stepping wrong, what makes you think he hasnt? He DID get spotted by humungulous after all. Just because everyone else was too busy with fleshy concerns like being devoured doesnt mean our ghost has never flubbed anything.

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## runeghost

> We're being told that things are really tough, that everyone is fighting / avoiding traps almost constant (except Lumi?), and Hector is helping out, because the Professor wants the dragon to reach the destination. I don't think Hector / Professor are both causing the problems and then solving them, so the monsters and traps are not under their control.
> 
> So ... why does Hector never step into a hole he can't climb out of? Never see a monster he's not equipped to fight? It's not like he's the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.


My guess is that he's got a Spark familiar with the place telling him exactly what to do, who he obeys quickly and without question.

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## Scarlet Knight

> So ... why does Hector never step into a hole he can't climb out of? Never see a monster he's not equipped to fight? It's not like he's the brightest bulb on the Christmas tree.


He has, and died from the fall...that's why he's a ghost. He's just presently in an experiment by Professor Box in keeping ghosts corporal...

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## Manga Shoggoth

> Possible thread title (slightly modified from strip): "I see many things. Usually, no one wants to hear about them."


Duly noted.




> For anyone who was worried about Humongulus overload... He's becoming pleasingly multifaceted.


Humongulus is responsible for a full two thirds of the thread titles so far! Humongulus can take on far more load than this!

Yes, the Foglios are being very good at providing him a little character.

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## Rockphed

> Possible thread title (slightly modified from strip): "I see many things. Usually, no one wants to hear about them."


I like it, but I would like it more as "I see many things. Would you like to hear about them?"

Also:

Girl Genius XXXII: Exciting Days Ahead!
Girl Genius XXXII: They can burst out ANYWHERE!
Girl Genius XXXII: What in the Earthly Realms?
Girl Genius XXXII: Our Job is to Talk About It

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## theangelJean

Why does Franz need a chef's toque, anyway? He's clearly not in charge of the cooking...

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## Gez

> Why does Franz need a chef's toque, anyway? He's clearly not in charge of the cooking...


Take a better look at panel #1...

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## theangelJean

I mean, he's definitely a heat source. But Vipsania's very much in charge. And it's not as if he has hair to keep out of the food!

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## Shining Wrath

Why would Franz even own a chef's toque in his size, let alone bring it on a journey into the wilderness? Whimsical is as whimsical does, I guess.

Interesting that Humongulous can feel fatigue.

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## Manga Shoggoth

> I like it, but I would like it more as "I see many things. Would you like to hear about them?"
> 
> Also:
> 
> Girl Genius XXXII: Exciting Days Ahead!
> Girl Genius XXXII: They can burst out ANYWHERE!
> Girl Genius XXXII: What in the Earthly Realms?
> Girl Genius XXXII: Our Job is to Talk About It


Noted.




> Why does Franz need a chef's toque, anyway? He's clearly not in charge of the cooking...


It's a torquing point.

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## Shining Wrath

> Noted.
> 
> 
> 
> It's a torquing point.


So a wrenching experience?

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## Gez

> I mean, he's definitely a heat source. But Vipsania's very much in charge. And it's not as if he has hair to keep out of the food!


Look, _you_ go tell the dragon he can't wear the hat because he's just the cooktop instead of the cook.

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## Shining Wrath

> Look, _you_ go tell the dragon he can't wear the hat because he's just the cooktop instead of the cook.


Vipsania did smack his finger with a meat fork - I don't think she's scared of Franz.
She's probably still a little more cautious than Lumi the nose-booper, though.

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