# Forum > Gaming > Roleplaying Games > D&D 5e/Next > DM Help Have a concept, need a plot

## Skrum

I'm in the brainstorming phase of game prep for something I'd like to run soon-ish, and I'm turning to the community for some crowdsourced help. 

*Spoiler: More Detailed Plot*
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 One character, Brad, is a paladin of a particular god that isn't the god the rest of his militaristic family worships. His background is he came to the main campaign setting seeking to make his own way, as opposed to following family traditions. But, after some amount of time, his cousin Lanzelet showed up, sent by Brad's father to convince Brad to return and take up his family obligations. The two of them have something of a frenemy relationship, but they grew up together and ultimately trust each other. Anyway, Lanzelet found an evil, corrupted sword that he recognized as the sword of an important paladin of Lanzelet's (and Brad's family's) faith. His last ditch effort to "save" Brad is going to be giving him this sword and asking Brad to go on a quest to cleanse it. Lanzelet thinks that in the process of doing this and earning the sword of an mythic paladin they both heard lots of stories about as kids, Brad will see the error in his ways and return to the faith. 



The basic idea is a character is going to be given an evil, corrupted sword that needs to be cleansed. The sword is a religious artifact, originally belonging to a powerful paladin of a faith that the character rejected. A family member, who hopes to convince to character to return to the faith, is giving him this sword and quest in the hopes that in the process of completing it, the character will return. 

What I ultimately want to happen is the character get a choice whether to cleanse the sword, returning it to its former glory, or sacrifice the sword somehow, and in the process prove his devotion to his current deity. 

Any ideas....? Meta-wise, I know exactly what choice the player is going to make; the family member is fighting a lost cause. But I would still like the choice in-game to be a meaningful and not obvious one.

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## Unoriginal

> I'm in the brainstorming phase of game prep for something I'd like to run soon-ish, and I'm turning to the community for some crowdsourced help. 
> 
> *Spoiler: More Detailed Plot*
> Show
> 
>  One character, Brad, is a paladin of a particular god that isn't the god the rest of his militaristic family worships. His background is he came to the main campaign setting seeking to make his own way, as opposed to following family traditions. But, after some amount of time, his cousin Lanzelet showed up, sent by Brad's father to convince Brad to return and take up his family obligations. The two of them have something of a frenemy relationship, but they grew up together and ultimately trust each other. Anyway, Lanzelet found an evil, corrupted sword that he recognized as the sword of an important paladin of Lanzelet's (and Brad's family's) faith. His last ditch effort to "save" Brad is going to be giving him this sword and asking Brad to go on a quest to cleanse it. Lanzelet thinks that in the process of doing this and earning the sword of an mythic paladin they both heard lots of stories about as kids, Brad will see the error in his ways and return to the faith. 
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Well the first question that should be asked to figure out the plot should be, IMO:

Why would the PC even take this quest in the first place?

'cause if the PC rejected that faith and that family, I don't see why they would agree to go on a quest on behalf of either. It's not like a militaristic faith would lack people to attempt doing the quest.

How about, instead:

The cousin shows up with a corrupted sword that needs to be cleansed. The sword is a relic that originally belonged to a powerful paladin, but pointedly the paladin was of *neither* the PC's family's faith nor the PC's current faith.

However, the sword was recently found in a corrupted place, where it was used to kill the being responsible for the corruption, so it was given to the PC's family's faith for purification. And the only way both the family and the PC know to do that on time is to go through a set of trials based around the faith's tenets and ideals to reach the consecrated spot that has the required purifying power (maybe it was used to keep the corrupting being at bay in the past or something). 

So, the conflict is as such: the PC can let their frenemy cousin carry the quest, but they will undoubtedly claim the sword in the name of the family's faith... or the PC can do the quest with their group, which would force the PC to participate in/interact on a deep level with the faith they rejected again but, in the cousin's mind, would remind them of all that is great about it and what it means to follow it.

Once the PCs reach the end, the paladin gets the chance to claim the sword for their current faith, to claim it for their family's faith (and so kind of starting returning to it at minimum), or respect the original paladin owner and clean the sword without imposing any faith on it that didn't belong there.

Could be fun if the original owner is a well-known, semi-legendary figure from the past that all the PCs have heard different things about but is generally considered a person who did a lot of good in the world, but in fact both the paladin PC and their family are very much mistaken about them, and when they used the sword they were in fact a barbarian hero/heroine. They only became paladin toward the end of their live, after they passed down the sword to a new generation of heroes. 

Could be even funnier if the paladin PC (and the cousin, who would have followed after the group (from far away that the group doesn't notice someone else is also doing the trials unless they check back a couple trial behind them) to see if their scheme worked) had a vision of the hero in the afterlife once the sword is cleansed, and this no matter to which religion it was consecrated to... and they're a very old, but very happy denizen of Ysgard, who doesn't care for the sword much at all but who shows respect if the PC didn't claim the sword for any religion (as for the hero, the sword should go to whoever does good with it, with petty side-taking among the do-gooders being a blight).

Not sure if that's helpful, but that's the idea your premise gave me.

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## Segev

Why would cleansing the sword be opposed to his current deity? Is his deity corrupt? 

What is his current god's ethos as opposed to that of his family's god? In particular, where (besides the name on their "deity of choice" blank in various official forms) does the problem arise? Or is it really just a matter of the faithful Packers, worshippers of the goddess of cheese, and the devoted Patriots, worshippers of the god of victory, having the same outlook (even the same holy days, rites of worship, etc.) except on really minor things and still hating each other enough that their churches view the other as horrifyingly heretical?

Knowing how the faiths differ and what reasons beyond merely "family duties" vs. "freedom therefrom" are the sources of contention would help a lot in formulating how and why this quest should work.

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## Skrum

> -snip-


So, I really like a lot of this, but unfortunately some of what I described is already baked in. The cousin is *my* character that I play as a PC (we have rotating DM's), and I'm going to use him as an NPC in my game to kick off this adventure. He's going to give the sword to Brad and basically ask him to cleanse the sword, thus proving that Brad is in fact a worthy and true follower of (the family faith). 




> Why would cleansing the sword be opposed to his current deity? Is his deity corrupt? 
> 
> What is his current god's ethos as opposed to that of his family's god? In particular, where (besides the name on their "deity of choice" blank in various official forms) does the problem arise? Or is it really just a matter of the faithful Packers, worshippers of the goddess of cheese, and the devoted Patriots, worshippers of the god of victory, having the same outlook (even the same holy days, rites of worship, etc.) except on really minor things and still hating each other enough that their churches view the other as horrifyingly heretical?
> 
> Knowing how the faiths differ and what reasons beyond merely "family duties" vs. "freedom therefrom" are the sources of contention would help a lot in formulating how and why this quest should work.


Brad's current deity is a scholarly god. His main spheres of influence are knowledge, justice, and history. Brad's family traditionally follows a more militaristic god, mostly associated with humans and "civil society." They aren't in conflict, they're both good-aligned gods, but Brad's choice to not follow family tradition is strongly related to him following his own way and not just resting on the laurels of his noble family. Lanzelet is very much the opposite; he's all about the divine right of kings (conceptually speaking), being rich is proof you're better than everyone else, etc. Brad genuinely wants to be a good person (but he's super clumsy about it), while Lanzelet wants to cover himself and his house in glory. 

My vague notion here was to set up some kind of choice where Brad can cleanse the sword and restore it to its former glory, thus in some way "returning" to his family calling, or he can sacrifice the sword for some cause he feels is the right one, and in the process prove that he has in fact chosen to follow the correct calling. I'm just really spinning my wheels at how to accomplish that.

Edit: More about Brad - 
Of note, Brad has narratively *not* "meshed" with his chosen deity. He swears himself to them, but his understanding of the faith is very....superficial. Brad's core concept is like a clumsy guy who means well and follows his instincts, but often doesn't know *why* he does things. This adventure is supposed to address that - prove to himself and to his family (via his cousin) that he is in fact doing what he's supposed to be doing.

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## Unoriginal

> So, I really like a lot of this, but unfortunately some of what I described is already baked in. The cousin is *my* character that I play as a PC (we have rotating DM's), and I'm going to use him as an NPC in my game to kick off this adventure. He's going to give the sword to Brad and basically ask him to cleanse the sword, thus proving that Brad is in fact a worthy and true follower of (the family faith).


Fair, but I still don't see any incentive for Brad do go along that plan.

I think the "you need to go through family's-faith-related trials in order to purify the sword" and "Lanzelet makes clear to Brad that if Brad doesn't do it, Lanzeleit will do it and 100% claim the sword for the faith" are points you can work in, or at least I don't see anything about those that doesn't work with what you said.

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## JLandan

The way I see it, Brad is not just an adherent of this different faith from his family. He is a PALADIN. That should be an unshakeable devotion. Unless it is a strong tenet of his faith to obey his father, he is under no obligation to do as his father commands.

Since the family faith left it to become corrupted, this heirloom, now Brad's possession, is up to Brad to restore its glory by converting it to his own faith; and increasing the glory of his own god. That is what a true Paladin would do.

Of course, this would be to the consternation of his family. They sought to use the sword to convert Brad to their faith, but he converted the sword to his own instead. Family drama ensues.

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## Segev

So, is it just that he's sorted into Ravenclaw rather than Gryffindor, and the family thinks he really should be proving himself Gryffindor material to live up to the family tradition, or is there more to it? Is his "go my own way" thing causing more problems/rifts than just him clumsily worshipping the "wrong" good god? 

I'm kind-of getting mixed messages about what this quest is meant to show/prove, too. Is it meant to show either way that he's still doing the family proud, or is it meant to convince him to come back to the "family church" if he makes one choice, and to show him that he needs to more deeply understand his current god if he makes the other?

What is the nature of the corruption of the sword? How did it happen, if that matters?



I think part of hte problem with coming up with a "how" stems from needing a firmer grasp on what the desired outcome is and why.

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## Tawmis

> I'm in the brainstorming phase of game prep for something I'd like to run soon-ish, and I'm turning to the community for some crowdsourced help. 
> *Spoiler: More Detailed Plot*
> Show
> 
>  One character, Brad, is a paladin of a particular god that isn't the god the rest of his militaristic family worships. His background is he came to the main campaign setting seeking to make his own way, as opposed to following family traditions. But, after some amount of time, his cousin Lanzelet showed up, sent by Brad's father to convince Brad to return and take up his family obligations. The two of them have something of a frenemy relationship, but they grew up together and ultimately trust each other. Anyway, Lanzelet found an evil, corrupted sword that he recognized as the sword of an important paladin of Lanzelet's (and Brad's family's) faith. His last ditch effort to "save" Brad is going to be giving him this sword and asking Brad to go on a quest to cleanse it. Lanzelet thinks that in the process of doing this and earning the sword of an mythic paladin they both heard lots of stories about as kids, Brad will see the error in his ways and return to the faith. 
> 
> 
> The basic idea is a character is going to be given an evil, corrupted sword that needs to be cleansed. The sword is a religious artifact, originally belonging to a powerful paladin of a faith that the character rejected. A family member, who hopes to convince to character to return to the faith, is giving him this sword and quest in the hopes that in the process of completing it, the character will return. 
> What I ultimately want to happen is the character get a choice whether to cleanse the sword, returning it to its former glory, or sacrifice the sword somehow, and in the process prove his devotion to his current deity. 
> Any ideas....? Meta-wise, I know exactly what choice the player is going to make; the family member is fighting a lost cause. But I would still like the choice in-game to be a meaningful and not obvious one.


So the easiest way I see to make this happen is...
Lanzelet shows up on the request of Brad's father, right - with this cursed blade.
So - Lanzelet reveals that Brad's father is dying of an illness.
And Lanzelet suspects that it may be tied to the corrupt blade.
Turns out that someone, many generations ago, in Brad (and his father's family line) used this blade that was blessed to fight (a horde of demons, works best - but really "any great evil force").
Said family member, helped win the battle - but in the heat of battle knew they would perish - so he made a dark pact with a dark god to turn the tide of battle.
The "blessed" blade now corrupt was passed from generation to generation, each using it - and slowly feeling the corruption in each of them.
Brad's father sensed the corruption and ceased using it - so, similar to drug addiction - it relentlessly called to him to provoke battles, but Brad's father resisted.
He continued to resist until finally his body broke beneath the stress and his health immediately and rapidly began declining.
Lanzelet explains that perhaps if the blade can be "redeemed" or "destroyed" - it may save Brad's father, and at the very least, break the curse that would surly fall on Brad's shoulders as the corrupted blade called out for the next in kin.

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## PoeticallyPsyco

You could make it so the sword has to be reforged as part of the purification process. The catch here is that it doesn't have to be reforged into another sword, just "the shape that will do the most good", revealing the paladin's worldview (which could in turn imply which religion is best for them).

Sword or other weapon - This says that the paladin believes the best use for magic metal is as a weapon for smiting evil. The cousin can (rightly) argue that with this worldview, the family's order is the best fit for the paladin.

Shield/armor - The best use for magic is defending the innocent. Cousin can still argue that this leans closer to a militaristic view than a scholarly one.

Tool - The best use for magic is to aid civilization. Most tools thus lean towards a worldview closer to the scholarly religion, some more than others (e.g. forging the sword into a number of magical keys), with the clever 'third path' option being a hammer that can be used for almost anything, from a weapon, to a forging tool, to a paperweight.

Using the magic to power a spell (ideally a divination) - This would be the fully scholarly option, choosing that the best use for a magic sword isn't physical at all, but using the magic to expand knowledge, which will outlive any physical object.

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