# Forum > Discussion > Mad Science and Grumpy Technology >  Recommendations for a replacement for a MFC-J480W

## Aotrs Commander

My Brother MFC-J480W (or MFC-J4800W as written on the side...) printer appears to have died, between one heartbeat and the next. After a print job (running out Deserts of Desolation), I started on the next one (the next version of the 3.Aotrs master rules...), and it started missing lines. Changed the cartridge, ran severla rounds of cleaning, no effect, which leads me to believe that it's probably something more serious like a print head.

It's not new, and it has had some hammer (it printed 1600 pages of 3.Aotrs since lockdown ended on top of normal regular usage), so it doesn't seem like the time or money to try fixing it.  (We bought it originally for my grandmother for infrequent use, but we inherited it when she died during lockdown.)

Thus, we appear to be in the market for a new printer. (We're in the UK.)

It would be nice if we could get one that will use the LC223 et al cartridges (because I JUST bought a new pack of them and not sure what to do with the otherwise). On the otyher hand, fighting the laser display that kept tellign me the cartridge was empoty when it wasn't (and having to tape over it until it ACTUALLY ran out of ink) was very annoying. So the primary criterion would be low-cost ink. Even if that means a more expensive printer. 

We have upstairs a DCP-197C, which is fine, but I fricking loathe it not having a screen display, since when it was downstairs, I had to get n my knees to peer at the LCD display. (Which is why that one went upstairs to be the secondary.)
The requirements are thus 

a) reasonable price cartridges

b) longevity

c) ability to print on cardboard (as we sometimes still need to print fold-flat cardboard buildings)

d) Price within reason. (I.e, sub £200 is possible.)

What would be some good recommendations?

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## Aotrs Commander

*sigh*

So, I got the upstiars printer down, and after an inordinate amount of effort, got it to work. It kept repeatedly printing the top few lines ad infiniteum. After a complete driver uninstall=>reboot=>driver install=> reboot=>USB in=>printer on, it actually work and printed a load of stuff. A few hours later, came to print the next lot... Same error again. Troubleshooters never found anything except printer queue issues. After performing the printer spooling stuff and it still not doing ouwt, we now suspect it may be the printer cable, since I recall having this problem before now. (It might explain the issues with Nanny's printer too.) So I have had Mum Prime us two new cables. (The one from upstairs is working with Dad's laptop, but the end is slightly damaged and it won't work with mine - I did try both, of course...)

If I am incredibly luck-ahahahahahahahaha, never going to happen; but there is an outside chance that the ne cable might be what's at fault, not the printers.

More likely, however, is of course the probability that BOTH Nanny's printer AND the attendant cable have failed simultaneously.

Becase of course.



I am trying so very hard not to say it looks like 2023 is trying very hard to get back to 2020/2021 after a passed-the-lowest-threashold 2022, but already, we've had to change the family holiday because the campsite we go to every year has been booked up (last year, couldn't book before January, contacted us; this year contacted them 3rd Jan, booked up.) And in trying something with a BattleTech bit of software (MegaMek), I discovered that the reason I couldn't follow the instructions properly was because the lastest version of one of the utilities they use was because the ultility had removed the plug-in from the frelling primary release and I had to hunt for it. (And THEN I found probably the ONLY mech out of thousands with an omission in it that complicated trying to get what I was doing to work. Because of course I would pick THAT ONE MECH.

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## tyckspoon

Do you have a frequent need for color/photo-type printing? It sounds like your primary usage is bulk black and white, in which case a small business/home-office grade laser printer would probably be more suitable as your primary printer - the toner cartridges in them are a bit more expensive (although cheaper on a per-page basis) but are intended to last for higher total yields, and the printers themselves are made to process larger print jobs/heavier duty cycles and should complain about it less than an inkjet (with the caveat that all printers and printer companies are fundamentally terrible and you will never find a 'good' one, just ones that are terrible in ways you can tolerate.)

Generically speaking, having a few known good/probably good USB accessory cables around to test/swap with is a good idea, and they should be inexpensive - you can order like a five-pack from Monoprice/Amazon Basics/similar supplier so that even if (..when) a couple of them turn out to be just badly manufactured you still have enough good ones to verify whether or not the connecting cable might be your issue.

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## Aotrs Commander

Update. New cables arrived.

Can now confirm Nanny's printer is FUBAR.

However, the upstairs printer appears to NOT like the top two of my rear USB ports, as it did exactly the same error behavior with those. Appears not to have the issue with the front USBs (but I can't stay there, since those are bespoke for a) my camera and b) the USB SD card reader for the 3D printer). I moved it down to a USB port directly below in the cluster of four (on the same piece of hardware) and appears to not have thrown any errors yet.

It is not an error introduced by the old cable (which might be fine), since I was doing this with the new cable.

Apparently, the DCP-197C just hates those upper two UBS ports specifically. Bear in mind Nanny's printer was fine on those, nor have any of the other peripherals in there (mouse/keyboard/joystick) have any problems, so the USB ports do not appear to he faulty or anything obvious, else you'd expect to have seen it (and have had the same issues with Nanny's printer).

So I don't even know.

The TL:DR is that we still need a new printer, but at least the back-up one is *touch wood* behaving on the slot it's currently on in the meantime.



(And tomorrow, I get the exciting job of Replacing All Of the Phone Handsets with the new ones and all the teething troubles thereof, because of course they need 16 hours charging before I can do anything with them.)

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## kyoryu

My first suggestion is that, unless you're doing a lot of photo printing, ditch the inket and switch to laser.

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## Aotrs Commander

> My first suggestion is that, unless you're doing a lot of photo printing, ditch the inket and switch to laser.


Are not colour laser printers extremely expensive?

We don't print a lot of photos, but the rules and record sheets we do do have some colour, so just black and white is a no-no.




We are now looking potentially at an Epson 2850 inktank printer. Printing speed is largely academic and likely not worse than Nanny's (and the time it would save automaticalpy printing 3.A et al double-sided would be enormous...)

Only possible downside is that I've heard it said some inktank printers have nonreplacable ink sponges.

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## halfeye

> Are not colour laser printers extremely expensive?


I'm seeing b+w from about £90, colour from about £210. Toner will be more expesive for colour though.

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## Aotrs Commander

> I'm seeing b+w from about £90, colour from about £210. Toner will be more expesive for colour though.


And toner is the more important cost for us, hense why we're looking at inktank printers. 

Cheap printer with expensive cartridges < expensive printer with cheap cartridges.

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## kyoryu

> Are not colour laser printers extremely expensive?
> 
> We don't print a lot of photos, but the rules and record sheets we do do have some colour, so just black and white is a no-no.


I got this one.  It's great.  Don't know if it qualifies as expensive to you.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1




> And toner is the more important cost for us, hense why we're looking at inktank printers. 
> 
> Cheap printer with expensive cartridges < expensive printer with cheap cartridges.


That's fair.  However I also found I lost a lot of ink due to it getting clogged if I don't print All The Time.  The full set of toner carts seems about $75, which isn't far off of ink.

https://www.amazon.com/dp/B098XKL5CQ...&pd_rd_plhdr=t

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## Aotrs Commander

> I got this one.  It's great.  Don't know if it qualifies as expensive to you.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B0...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
> 
> 
> 
> That's fair.  However I also found I lost a lot of ink due to it getting clogged if I don't print All The Time.  The full set of toner carts seems about $75, which isn't far off of ink.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/dp/B098XKL5CQ...&pd_rd_plhdr=t


That qualifies as both expensive printer AND expensive cartridges! (But that's why we're not looking at a colour laser.)

(Around 300-330 quid and supposedly £68-104 (!) quid for toner (times four) - it wasn't even easy to find with a google search. Heck, it looked like most places that sold it were out of stock too - Amazon UK didn't even have it nor the toners, apparently. It reckons 1350 pages per toner cartridge. (Printing out just the 3.Aotrs spells is 300 pages...) Definitely the wrong order of magnitude for toner prices as far as we're concerned.

By comparison, the Epson official refill for the 2850 was £11 at Currys (not a place I would us for preference, since they aren't always very cheap) and it reckoned the black was (and I take this is a strong grain of salt, admittedly) good for 14000 pages.

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## kyoryu

> That qualifies as both expensive printer AND expensive cartridges! (But that's why we're not looking at a colour laser.)
> 
> (Around 300-330 quid and supposedly £68-104 (!) quid for toner (times four) - it wasn't even easy to find with a google search. Heck, it looked like most places that sold it were out of stock too - Amazon UK didn't even have it nor the toners, apparently. It reckons 1350 pages per toner cartridge. (Printing out just the 3.Aotrs spells is 300 pages...) Definitely the wrong order of magnitude for toner prices as far as we're concerned.
> 
> By comparison, the Epson official refill for the 2850 was £11 at Currys (not a place I would us for preference, since they aren't always very cheap) and it reckoned the black was (and I take this is a strong grain of salt, admittedly) good for 14000 pages.


Anyway, I had an Epson tank one, and I found that it quickly got jammed and didn't want to clean itself.  I may not be printing as frequently as you are.  But, hey, whatever works for you!

But with the issues and whatnot, inkjets have proven themselves, to me, to be less cost effective. I just toss too many cartridges, and the ink tank one wasn't any better, really.  Hope you find something that works!

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## Trafalgar

Back in 2008 when I was working on my grad degree, I bought a Brother HL-5370DW Printer. Its a black and white printer that prints on both side. 

The thing is a TANK. It doesn't break. I think I have only replaced the cartridge like twice. Between school, work, and the kids, its awesome. I think at work we have gone through 3 or 4 printers in the same time period. 

I can't recommend it enough. I would say check Ebay but anyone who has one is probably not willing to give it up.

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## Aotrs Commander

*sigh*

This is frustratingly apparently a nearly impossible task. It does not help that  our requirements are do not really sit with any printers (i.e. low usage and then high spike usase infrquently).
It seems like all we hace is a choice of which company to present our posteriors to be rogered with a club with nails in it by.

I spoke to my mate. He also wasn't impressed with inktank printers and said "toners."

I looked some more. They are still about twice as expensive I looked at the Brother Brother HL-L3230CDW; £200 plus about another £200 for toner (for 3400 to 2600 pages B/colour). Dad is still unwilling to go to that sort of expense.

So, looking at standard ink jet.

HP are only interested in selling you on ink subscriptions and ink seems to be proiced in that regard, i.e. expensive to deliberately encourage you. NO.

Epson seems to be the ones most predominating on the market and the WorkForce WF-2870DWF, Pro WF-3820DWF and WF-4820 are variously reasonably recommended and have performance of a reasonable level. Problem being, they are Epson, who apparently have such a habit of updating their firmware to stop third party cartridges working they've been subjected to a class action lawsuit, which does not encourage me. The Epson 2850 also keeps getting mentioned, and if it were not for the apparent problems with inktanks and some people saying some Epson printers also have a built in obsolesence (which in light of the aforementioned, bears credibility) I would have stuck with that.

Brother's most reasonable printer is the MFC-J4335DW - inktank. The DCP-J1200W is a dubious possibility - it doens't have automatic duplex printing, (neither do the printers we're replacing, but I'm tired of printing hundreds of pages in little bits, it takes all day). Unfortunately, that appears to be the current deeply unhappy compromise... And ink is about £50 for a set and I can't even see any compatible third party ones.

Canon does not appear to have anything not suited for photo printing and what we want is primarily BW with some colour and occasionally some photos/pictures, but not for "hang photo on wall" levels.

And I've been at this for some hours now, I'm going to have to stop.

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## gomipile

Despite the initial cost of toner cartridges, have you looked at the price per page? It should be comparable to the ink tank printers, and better than the cartridge inkjets you're used to.

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## Aotrs Commander

> Despite the initial cost of toner cartridges, have you looked at the price per page? It should be comparable to the ink tank printers, and better than the cartridge inkjets you're used to.


Dad has said emphatically, he's not spending the money to get a laser printer; it's too much out of the budget. A £250 inktank printer with refils at a tenner (for supposed 14000 pages) is one thing, but £400 (plus?) for a laser printer and a batch of toner (which we would need on standby) is quite another.

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## halfeye

> Dad has said emphatically, he's not spending the money to get a laser printer; it's too much out of the budget. A £250 inktank printer with refils at a tenner (for supposed 14000 pages) is one thing, but £400 (plus?) for a laser printer and a batch of toner (which we would need on standby) is quite another.


My problem with inkjets was the print heads clogging when they weren't used for a year or two. Lasers aren't that much better it seems, the toner can go funny, given enough time. I've not used a colour laser.

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