# Forum > Gaming > Roleplaying Games > D&D 3e/3.5e/d20 >  Craziest Character Concepts?

## SangoProduction

I've done this series twice before. Though never while I was actually working. I have... *checks time...* today off. I want to kill some time, as I am currently sick as a dog.

I want to be given some character concept that you've either been unable to create a functional build for, or that you'd think wouldn't be normally possible in D&D/PF. 
And as soon as I can get to it, I will go ahead and try to create a build for you. Or at least the scaffolding of a build... or just saying something like "Yeah, that's going to be around a level 50 character, at which point the specific build doesn't matter."

So far, I've only been stumped by 2 suggestions so far (and a kind fellow assisted me in getting one taken care of). So I'm rather interested in what you guys got..

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## Particle_Man

The creator Gods sibling, who is allowed to step into a recently available (ie freshly killed) mortal body and look at the created world from that point of view.  They can only use the powers that the previous ow we of the body had, although they themselves are the new source of said powers (they have more powers - this is an agreement with the elder sibling, on the honour system).  But they still have all the divine knowledge they had, and know whatever of this world was told in bardic  tales and religious texts, but (at least at first) only that knowledge of this world (so if apple pies were not mentioned they would not know of them or how they taste).

So I guess a 9th level warlock in agreed powers but some knowledge skills through the roof?

Also if their new body dies they just hop to another freshly killed persons body and are bound to only use the powers that body had.  That could continue.

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## Gruftzwerg

> The creator Gods sibling, who is allowed to step into a recently available (ie freshly killed) mortal body and look at the created world from that point of view.  They can only use the powers that the previous ow we of the body had, although they themselves are the new source of said powers (they have more powers - this is an agreement with the elder sibling, on the honour system).  But they still have all the divine knowledge they had, and know whatever of this world was told in bardic  tales and religious texts, but (at least at first) only that knowledge of this world (so if apple pies were not mentioned they would not know of them or how they taste).
> 
> So I guess a 9th level warlock in agreed powers but some knowledge skills through the roof?
> 
> Also if their new body dies they just hop to another freshly killed persons body and are bound to only use the powers that body had.  That could continue.


"twins" = checked
"join a host body and take control" = checked

Sounds a lot like my Sakon & Ukon build (see signature), except that the victim doesn't need to be killed. Ukon becomes a symbiotic template for his Ghostly Visage familiar (Dread Necromancer). This form gives him the "Meld" ability to join other creatures body. From here he can try to gain control over the body if he wants. The details are to much to write it all up (again), thus if you are interested have a look at the build.

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## SangoProduction

> The creator Gods sibling, who is allowed to step into a recently available (ie freshly killed) mortal body and look at the created world from that point of view.  They can only use the powers that the previous ow we of the body had, although they themselves are the new source of said powers (they have more powers - this is an agreement with the elder sibling, on the honour system).  But they still have all the divine knowledge they had, and know whatever of this world was told in bardic  tales and religious texts, but (at least at first) only that knowledge of this world (so if apple pies were not mentioned they would not know of them or how they taste).
> 
> So I guess a 9th level warlock in agreed powers but some knowledge skills through the roof?
> 
> Also if their new body dies they just hop to another freshly killed persons body and are bound to only use the powers that body had.  That could continue.


So, distilling it down: A character who reincarnates on death, using the new body's "powers" rather than their own set (despite being the source of their power). Unless I'm misunderstanding, that's accomplished by rerolling the character on death, and playing it off as though the characters had the same experiences - keeping the same mental ability score lay out. It is also basically the definition of either sorcerer or divine soul. Sage from Champions of the Spheres also works.

I would take the following Advanced Divination sphere talent: Power of the Name (lets you detect anyone talking about you within 1 mile - a power every god has, but limited range).

As well as the following Mind sphere talents: Intuit Knowledge (Taps into "your own cognition" to understand something - basically bardic knowledge on non-bards), Polyglot (Passively have "basic grasp of concepts" of any language. Spell point for tongues), Mental Archives (Photographic memory), Terrifying Mind (Succeeding on will saves inflicts fear on casters)
(Those Mind sphere talents are all cognition talents, and many DMs, including me, say you can take 2 talents for the use of one.)

This Advanced Mind Sphere talent: Epiphany (Upgrade to Intuit Knowledge).

If not playing a Spheres class, you can still take a talent as a feat. Highest priority on Intuit knowledge, and then Epiphany at level 5.
If you do play Sage, as a Ki Blaster, you can select Revivifying Ki Blast, which lets you revive yourself if you would die (with a relatively intact body, granted). Along with the Permanent Transformation general feat on the Spheres wiki, and DM permission to change the transformation once each time you are thusly killed could work... Except that you are obviously changing your form rather than picking up a new body.... oooo. 

I haven't gotten to shill one of own custom classes before. Well, my Gravecrawler class... actually fits shockingly well. Although it's got the written fluff of a more insectoid brood symbiont, just change Vermin to Outsider, and you've got a nearly perfect representation of your god just hopping onto some dead dude. Even has the reincarnation ability you're looking for (at level 20 though).
You could also choose to, for example, give yourself the drawback of only being able to "Implant a drone," on those who believe in you (the god). I think I'm going to write an archetype for my homebrew class. Boy you got me excited,

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## Rebel7284

Well I always wanted to build a Master Transmogrifist 10 that also gets access to Shapechange before Epic.

Something like Bard 3/Master Transmogrifist 7/Sublime Chord 2/MT +3/Full Casting 5

Alter Self is easy to get from a spelltouched feat - Momentary Alteration, however, I never found any way to get Polymorph as a SLA early. 

I also wanted to avoid particularly questionable rules abuses such as bootstrap wizard or lycanthropy/thought bottle/rebuilding rules.

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## SangoProduction

> Well I always wanted to build a Master Transmogrifist 10 that also gets access to Shapechange before Epic.
> 
> Something like Bard 3/Master Transmogrifist 7/Sublime Chord 2/MT +3/Full Casting 5
> 
> Alter Self is easy to get from a spelltouched feat - Momentary Alteration, however, I never found any way to get Polymorph as a SLA early. 
> 
> I also wanted to avoid particularly questionable rules abuses such as bootstrap wizard or lycanthropy/thought bottle/rebuilding rules.


I don't know why Wizard 8 into Transmogrifist doesn't fit your requirements. You may simply be trying to overthink it? OK, you mean the 9th level spell, Shapechange. Without funky rules that I don't know about, you won't be able to take more than 6 levels of the prestige class and still cast 9th level spells.

But if you want to get _basically_ everything from Transmogrifist (aside from the 3.5 monster dumpster diving, since PF made transformation to simply be changes to character stats rather than replacements to them, and getting whatever random set of abilities the monster had)...
I would recommend the (spheres) Shifter class, taking Alteration sphere. From level 1, you can start cosplaying as a doppelganger, and change into a draconic form. It doesn't have permanent alter self (until level 20), but its transformations are at hours/level. At level 20, you can get colossal and fine sized transformations with the Size Mastery advanced talent, which is pre-epic, and (again, ignoring the dumpster diving), simulates what Shapechange can do.

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## Gruftzwerg

> Well I always wanted to build a Master Transmogrifist 10 that also gets access to Shapechange before Epic.
> 
> Something like Bard 3/Master Transmogrifist 7/Sublime Chord 2/MT +3/Full Casting 5
> 
> Alter Self is easy to get from a spelltouched feat - Momentary Alteration, however, I never found any way to get Polymorph as a SLA early. 
> 
> I also wanted to avoid particularly questionable rules abuses such as bootstrap wizard or lycanthropy/thought bottle/rebuilding rules.


If you can buy off LA:

White Dragonspawn (+1LA) gives +1 Sorcerer
DWK Greater Draconic Rite of Passage gives another +1 Sorcerer

"Sorcerer 5 / M. Transmogrifist 10 / XXX 5" could get up to 18th lvl Sorcerer casting if the +1LA is bought off.

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## Quertus

Well, my white whale is an illiterate Wizard with Int 9 or less who *somehow* still manages not to be completely useless.

I also would love to see a goo girl build. Emphasis on it feeling like form is arbitrary over effectiveness, although I imagine it should be some form of durable.

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## SangoProduction

> If you can buy off LA:
> 
> White Dragonspawn (+1LA) gives +1 Sorcerer
> DWK Greater Draconic Rite of Passage gives another +1 Sorcerer
> 
> "Sorcerer 5 / M. Transmogrifist 10 / XXX 5" could get up to 18th lvl Sorcerer casting if the +1LA is bought off.


Appreciate it. 




> Well, my white whale is an illiterate Wizard with Int 9 or less who *somehow* still manages not to be completely useless.
> 
> I also would love to see a goo girl build. Emphasis on it feeling like form is arbitrary over effectiveness, although I imagine it should be some form of durable.



A literal wizard of int 9 or less? I would focus on the Familiar, due to lacking castable spells. At least directly castable. You still have a spell list, and UMD is charisma based. If you catch my drift. A one level dip in 3.5's barbarian gets you illiteracy. You don't need it anyway, since you're not casting. It does keep you from using scrolls though, unless you also take the Scroll Scholar pathfinder archetype for wizard, which gives you Comprehend Languages as a spell-like ability... which is a lot of effort to go through just to regain your original capacity.

Spell Slinger lets you spend spell slots to empower your gun (if you know what I mean). You don't need to cast anything. It even changes read magic from a cantrip into a 1st level spell so that you can be truly illiterate. You could take the Sin Magic school, for an additional spell slot of each spell level, compared to any other arcane school, but you'd hardly run out either way with this set up.

But if you want to be close to your concept: Sorcerer, for one. And for two, you should note that casting is based on the *spell level* not the spell slot. So with intelligence 11, you can cast a metamagiced 9th slot Magic Missile as a Wizard / Magic Missile Mage. I had to retire that 18th level half orc wizard of mine, who was draped in nothing but a loin cloth, because I was outshining the epic level deity-spawn players at the table. Granted. I think I stacked the same metamagic effect multiple times on the same spell for a higher slot, because literally no one else at my table (nor myself) had ever used metamagic before. 

If you've got that feat which lets you prepare a spell without your spell book, you can even pick up illiteracy from barbarian 1 and lose no effectiveness. (Also, your "illiteracy" can just be a player choice rather than mechanically enforced. Not everything needs to be mechanics.)
-
As for the "goo girl," there's the Suli race, as well as the (spheres) Shifter class, with a focus on the Alteration sphere. Pick up the drawbacks: Lycanthropic (can only transform self), and Unnatural Transformation (makes you obviously transformed - lets you be an obvious "slime in a different shape," while getting a benefit from it).
Picking up the Life sphere grants healing.
Guardian sphere gives a "delayed pool," which allows you to delay a certain amount of damage based on BAB.
Berserker sphere lets you gain -2 AC for 3+BAB temp hp for a round.
I also like Creation sphere with Fission drawback to be able to create objects out of your own body, and reabsorb them to regain the hp you spent.

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## Metastachydium

> I also would love to see a goo girl build.


What's a "goo girl"? A girl made of goo? If so, SlythUnd is a playable race that can turn into a puddle of goo, whereas a great favourite of mine, the 3.0 Oozemaster PrC from _Maters of the Wild_ can grant the ability to become and behave oozelike in various ways (while becoming increasingly gross!). _Savage Species_ also has an LA for the Phasm (+7, to be specific), if that helps, and the same book gave the world the Gelatinous Creature template which even _SS_ deems unplayable, but only because it sets INT to 1  an issue adding a second template can fix (in theory).

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## Tzardok

> A one level dip in 3.5's barbarian gets you illiteracy.


I'm pretty sure that you get automatic literacy from taking any PC class except Barbarian, and that you can't lose it. You would need to take some kind of alternate class feature or flaw to trade away literacy.

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## Rebel7284

> If you can buy off LA:
> 
> White Dragonspawn (+1LA) gives +1 Sorcerer
> DWK Greater Draconic Rite of Passage gives another +1 Sorcerer
> 
> "Sorcerer 5 / M. Transmogrifist 10 / XXX 5" could get up to 18th lvl Sorcerer casting if the +1LA is bought off.


I was excited about this until I realized that anything that is not a human or half-elf becomes a Dragonspawn Abomination instead... not to mention that dragons can't take White Dragonspawn at all  :Small Confused: 

I guess if Loredrake is allowed on Kobolds, this approach works, but Loredrake would definitely raise eyebrows at most tables!

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## Gruftzwerg

> I was excited about this until I realized that anything that is not a human or half-elf becomes a Dragonspawn Abomination instead... not to mention that dragons can't take White Dragonspawn at all 
> 
> I guess if Loredrake is allowed on Kobolds, this approach works, but Loredrake would definitely raise eyebrows at most tables!


It's about the order of application:

1: Be a Kobold (humanoid)
2: Pick up the template (W. Dragonspawn)
3: Pick up the feat (DWK)
3: Draconic Reservoir(feat) + Greater Ritual of Draconic Passage



Edit: Sry, misremembered. You don't need to be a DWK, that is optional (and still works due to order of application). But you can also do it as regular Kobold.

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## Rebel7284

> It's about the order of application:
> 
> 1: Be a Kobold (humanoid)
> 2: Pick up the template (W. Dragonspawn)
> 3: Pick up the feat (DWK)
> 3: Draconic Reservoir(feat) + Greater Ritual of Draconic Passage
> 
> 
> 
> Edit: Sry, misremembered. You don't need to be a DWK, that is optional (and still works due to order of application). But you can also do it as regular Kobold.


RE: DWK - While this works if you're following the character creation rules in a vacuum, it completely ignores the flavor of the feat and template.  Dragonwraught Kobolds are explicitly born with the feat, it's effectively inherited, while the spawn template is an acquired template.  Unless you argue that it was applied in-utero I guess, in which case it works perfectly but raises A LOT of questions that most D&D tables don't want to tackle. 😂

With that said, the Spawn template was stealth nerfed in Bestiary of Krynn p. 24 and can only be applied to humans and half-elves.

It looks like the regular Kobold could still pick up the spawn template and get all the benefits, BUT also would be forced to take the Abomination template which is also +1 LA.  To be fair, the extra LA could ALSO be bought off, and while the Int and Wis penalties hurt, they're not game-breaking for a Sorcerer.  And of course if you can select from the random roll table yourself instead of rolling, you can even get another level of sorcerer to counteract the LA! 

There is something to be said that an abomination going into Master Transmogrifist to even further embrace its weirdness is pretty good flavor if you can buy off the +2 LA total!  Some of those other mutations offer very nifty bonuses too!

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## lylsyly

The rsponse to that is Dragonlance campaign setting is 1st party but the bestiary of krynn was 3rd party. Technically at a table like ours you could apply both the draconic template for LA +1 and the white Dragonspawn for +1 = +2. Someone, don't remeber who exactly tried to tell me I could not apply the dragonspawn templates to anything but a human or elf a couple of years back.

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## vasilidor

I forget the name of it, but there is a prestige class that allows a character to make a whirlwind attack in place of all of their iterative attacks. I was going to combine that with the dervish dancer on a warforged named ginsu. It was for an epic game.

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## Particle_Man

> Well, my white whale is an illiterate Wizard with Int 9 or less who *somehow* still manages not to be completely useless.
> 
> I also would love to see a goo girl build. Emphasis on it feeling like form is arbitrary over effectiveness, although I imagine it should be some form of durable.


For the former I once did a cleric/magic-user with 9 int and (I think) 13 wis in 1st Ed AD&D but to be fair that one did cast spells.  Maybe in 3rd Ed this wizard could use wands/staffs and maybe try out prestige classes you normally would not, like Green Star Adept.

For the goo girl, I wonder if dralasite from d20 future/star frontiers could be adapted?

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## Telonius

I'm seeing some online sources that say Dragon #304 has an "Awaken Ooze" spell. If the group is open to that, it could be a way to take the "Gelatinous"-templated human and make it into a playable "goo girl."

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## Bullet06320

there is a flaw in one of the dragon mags
"no time for book learning"
your illiterate

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## ShurikVch

> I'm seeing some online sources that say Dragon #304 has an "Awaken Ooze" spell. If the group is open to that, it could be a way to take the "Gelatinous"-templated human and make it into a playable "goo girl."


Note: Gelatinous Creature template (_Savage Species_) changes type to Aberration - not Ooze - and lot a legit target for the _Awaken Ooze_

Slime Creatures (_Dungeon_ #132), on the other hand, are Oozes.
It's not really a template: transformed creature don't get from the "original" anything except the size and general shape (thus, Medium - or Small - Slime Creature from a girl would give the desired result)

*Spoiler: There is how it looks - with a Gray Render as the "example victim"*
Show



(Tiny - or smaller - creatures can't become Slime Creatures: instead, they would transform into a Small patch of Olive Slime)

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## Metastachydium

> I'm pretty sure that you get automatic literacy from taking any PC class except Barbarian, and that you can't lose it. You would need to take some kind of alternate class feature or flaw to trade away literacy.





> there is a flaw in one of the dragon mags
> "no time for book learning"
> your illiterate


Better yet, there's a trait straight in _UA_ that does the same! It's called _[drum roll]_ Illiterate.




> Note: Gelatinous Creature template (_Savage Species_) changes type to Aberration - not Ooze - and lot a legit target for the _Awaken Ooze_


Eh, that's not really the issue with Gelatinous. There's a lot of ways to raise INT 1 to INT 3+ regardless of type. The main issue is, it's not officially playable and has no official LA. Of course, if the slimy Dungeon template goes around that issue, it's still better.

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## SangoProduction

Since no more concepts are coming in, I will take this opportunity to point out that April Augmented 2014 from Dreamscarred Press features the Gelatinous Cube monster class. Granted, it's broken to all hell, because paralysis on touch is just broken. But it's yet another playable jellyman thing.

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## Gruftzwerg

> Since no more concepts are coming in, I will take this opportunity to point out that April Augmented 2014 from Dreamscarred Press features the Gelatinous Cube monster class. Granted, it's broken to all hell, because paralysis on touch is just broken. But it's yet another playable jellyman thing.


If you like paralysis, I would like to point you to Dread Necromancer. They can get a Ghostly Visage as familiar!
And those have a nice ability:




> Anyone within 30 feet of a ghostly visage who meets the eyes of its manifested face (see visage below) must make a Will saving throw (DC 13) or be *paralyzed with fear* for 1d4 rounds. Ghostly visages are immune to their own gaze attacks and to those of others of their kind.


1. It's a fear based paralysis. Thus anything fear immune is also immune to the paralysis. A lil downside but we can't have everything..^^

2. As familiar its ability DC scale with the master's HD. DC= 10 + 1/2 HD + CHA

This gives use a scaling 30feet cone paralysis effect at will. Or better said our familiar who will manifest over the Dread Necro's face and use his own actions every turn for the paralysis effect^^

I've abused this in a recent Iron Chef contest for Berserker as SI (the Ghostly Visage can also "Meld" into creatures and take control over em. I used this to bypass the Berserker Rage ability which lets you possibly attack allies otherwise). Imho the Dread Necro gish (ubercharger) turned out really crazy strong imho.

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