# Forum > Gaming > Roleplaying Games > D&D 3e/3.5e/d20 >  Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil: Exciting or Boring?

## northernbard80

The 2001 release of Return to the Temple of Elemental Evil for 3E rules was hailed by fans of the original modules.  It is fun as I've read through the whole scenario.  Dungeon did list RttToEE as the 8th best DND adventure of all time back in 2004 and Dungeon Master for Dummies also listed the adventure as one of the ten best for 3E.

Yet, the adventure has its detractors.  The bulk of the setting is set in the Temple of All-Consumption, divided into the Crater Ridge Mindes, Outer Fane & Inner Fane; that's about 300 different areas!  The text even admits this is a long-term undertaking with advice on how to handle it.  Some players have actually mutinied against their DMs or have outright quit due to boredom of having to go through a 300-area megadungeon.

So here's my questions:

1.  Is RttToEE a fun scenario to play?

2.  How do you handle the challenge, length and possible exhaustion of the Temple of All-Consumption megadungeon?

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## Crake

If players start to get bored, I don't imagine you need to run the entire module in one continuous run. You can have side plots in nearby towns that take attention from the players, and the temple can be something the players come back to time after time to keep pushing that plot. Module may need some adjustment to fit that paradigm though.

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## Paragon

I ran it a couple years ago.

My advice would be that if you have new players that are not comfortable with roleplaying a character out of the blue, this kind of hack and slash adventure is fun. I added extra steps to the intrigue so has to actually have to follow it because they could just go through the circle just because there were always more critters.

Second, I'd say this is more of a "let's play for a week of vacation" than "let's meet only I'll once a week/month" type of campaign. You'll get more easily bored if your mind goes in and out of this formidable dungeoncrawl than if you power through it.

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## Friend

It's tangential to this thread, but I'm quite interested to know what the rest of that top #10 list was (and was it editors picks or based on fan feedback?)

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## northernbard80

> It's tangential to this thread, but I'm quite interested to know what the rest of that top #10 list was (and was it editors picks or based on fan feedback?)


https://shopontheborderlands.co.uk/2...ventures-time/

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## Kurald Galain

> 1.  Is RttToEE a fun scenario to play?


Frankly, no. The story is cliched, there are no memorable characters in the scenario, and almost all of it is a dungeoncrawl with no thematic consistency. It feels like it was generated from random tables ("and in room 47, you meet... 1d6 otyughs who are... talkative and hungry, and are guarding... 2d10 gemstones").

Also, the enemies are almost universally melee mooks with little or no ranged capability or spellcasting. So it's pretty monotonous; and since you can find a resting spot pretty much everywhere, they're not particularly threatening either.

One star out of five, do not recommend.

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## Harrow

I actually just finished running a group through Return to the Temple last week. It was the final push I needed to decide to switch over from pre-built modules to working on my own campaign. There were a lot of little problems. 

Two of my players grew up playing the Temple of Elemental Evil computer game (alongside Baldur's Gate and Planescape: Torment) and were really excited about this campaign going in. It did not deliver. The Temple of Elemental Evil that you Return to isn't actually much of a feature, despite that being the name of the module. So, that was a disappointment. 

I recall dragons being used on three separate occasions, one of them rather early on. I nerfed the first one to prevent a session 1 TPK, the second one they tried to fight, ran from from, and came back later better prepared for (which I consider a great success), and the third one killed most of the party in the surprise round (it turned invisible whenever someone opened its door. An odd strategy for something in the Outer Fane. You'd think it would have more friendlies coming through than enemies, and it should also cause it to start he fight down a few spell slots) with its breath weapon and then won initiative against the last member standing. I retconned that fight because I didn't want the hassle of everyone making new characters and then figuring out how to get them back into the Outer Fane, replacing it with lesser draconic enemies rather than a true dragon.

*Spoiler: dragon rant*
Show

On the topic of dragons, I have come to hate them. Their CR is intentionally too low. This means that, either, the DM knows this and makes you fight a weaker dragon that you can still take on, in which case you're being robbed of XP for what is already a tough fight, or you don't adjust and go by CR rather than strength, in which case you risk a TPK. You might be able to argue that they are supposed to be reserved for boss fights, where you learn about your opponent ahead of time because facing them unprepared is obviously stupid, but that means you need some method of signalling to the party "Hey, big guy ahead!". If you just use them as random encounters, as this module did thrice, then they're robbed of the prestige they're supposed to have AND you're smashing the party against a brick wall in a manner that feels rather unfair.


As a DM, I had problems with the plot. I like to start each session with a recap of what happened last session to help keep everyone on track and I frequently felt like even I didn't know why the party was supposed to be where they were or what they were trying to accomplish. I used the missing wizard to hook the party into going to the moathouse, but the only lead on how to get to the Temple of All Consumption, where most of the game is supposed to take place, is hidden in a secret cult base in Hommlet. My players could have found the secret base on their own, but the module didn't include much in the way of signs to the players that they even needed to be looking for such a thing. I ended up having to have an NPC ask about inquiring into the whereabouts of the missing miller, whose basement the cult was hiding in. I thought he idea of running modules was that the DM didn't have to worry about stuff like that for the most part.

Overall, it was just a lot more work for me as a DM than I cared for. If I'm going to be putting in that much effort, I may as well make something of my own.

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## smetzger

> 1.  Is RttToEE a fun scenario to play?
> 
> 2.  How do you handle the challenge, length and possible exhaustion of the Temple of All-Consumption megadungeon?


1. I have run it 3 different times, all enjoyable.

2. challenge - first time I ran it was early 3.0 and early 3.5. So, pretty much core only.  I would tell the players before each session "Your probably going to die".  It wasn't exhausting at all as it was a big challenge for a core only game.
2nd time I ran it was much later in 3.5 and the party was much more optimized.  I had to constantly boost the opposition.  If I did it again I would go with 25 point buy and maybe even start at a lower level.

But the first time I ran it Monte's boards were very active with advice that was instrumental. 
Link to Monte's Forum
https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/okay...ntal-evil-f12/

If you don't have the Errata/FAQ and 3.5 it is here
http://zansforcans.net/v35/RttToEE%2...FAQ%20v3.5.pdf

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## Thurbane

We're playing through it at the moment. Started at 1st with some filler modules, currently well in RttToEE, just hit character level 8.

As a bonus, being run by the DM who use to run ToEE for us back in our 1E days.

I'm really enjoying it, but a lot of that is probably nostalgia...

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