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2022-08-24, 02:17 PM (ISO 8601)
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
This would be a Practiced Spellcaster type of effect - if your Leadership score isn't high enough to attract the maximum level of cohort you are otherwise entitled to (for example say you have a low or even negative Charisma modifer, maybe have the penalties for 'moves around a lot' and getting a previous cohort killed so your basic score no longer gets your cohort to level cap) then this bonus can catch you up. Functional rule, just limited in application as the kinds of characters that typically take Leadership won't often need that benefit.
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2022-08-24, 02:35 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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- Tula, Russia
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2022-08-24, 02:45 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2007
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- Indianapolis
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Well, cohort level is affected by both the character's level and their Leadership score - you get the lower of what is permitted by your leadership score, or (Level -2.) If you Leadership score is too low you may not be able to get the maximum level cohort you otherwise would have (but if you have a long-term cohort you've probably leveled them up by their own XP gain rather than trying to attract a new one at base level anyways.)
For followers, yeah, it would appear to do absolutely nothing, as those have no other limit other than the one given by the chart and the ability explicitly does not count for that. :shrug: Like I said, it works.. just what it works on is a very niche and small scope.
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2022-08-25, 02:27 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2014
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- Arcadia
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Last edited by Inevitability; 2022-08-25 at 02:27 AM.
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2022-08-25, 04:04 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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- Tula, Russia
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Thus, it falls to the definition of what, exactly, is "maximum level cohort"...
OK, "dysfunction by specific reading" - not a valid dysfunction
Chalk it to the "authors don't know how their own rules work" (like "Armored Uncanny Dodge", "Tumbler's Breastplate", etc)Last edited by ShurikVch; 2022-08-25 at 04:04 AM.
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2022-09-17, 07:01 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2011
Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Another dysfunctional spell: Hibernate, from Frostburn. It claims to 'put a creature in suspended animation for weeks at a time', but when it lists out what this 'suspension of life functions' actually does, all it mentions is: automatically stabilizes a dying creature, saves starving or dehydrated creatures from death, and slows natural healing to 1hp/week. Nothing at all about loss of consciousness or inability to take actions. And it lasts 1 week per CL.
Last edited by Monarch Dodora; 2022-09-17 at 07:02 AM.
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2022-09-17, 01:49 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- Jun 2020
Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
It really does shock me sometimes how literally unusable some things in this game are since the writers didn’t know there own rules. Leadership checks are one of those things that don’t make sense at all as far as I can tell
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2022-09-20, 05:05 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2010
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- France
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
One thing that may not be really dysfunctional, but always struck me as odd, is the "[creature] affinity" part of the Bloodline rules.
It gives a bonus (+2, +4 or +6) to some interpersonal skill checks (Bluff, Diplomacy, Gather Information, Intimidate, and Perform) when interacting with the specific creatures from which a character with a bloodline is related.
My problem is... character with a hybrid template doesn't get any such bonus (for example, a half-dragon doesn't have a +6 or +8 bonus on these skills with true dragons). And I would assume the bloodline is much more diluted with the basic bloodline rules.
Nor full-blooded creatures get a +8 or +10 bonus on these skills with member of their own race. Maybe they should, but with the current rules, that's nowhere the case.
So, what makes character with a diluted bloodline so much more attractive/efficient with their remote relatives?Spoiler
DM: At the end of the meal, the innkeeper is bringing you the cheese plate. Roll for initiative.
PC: Excuse me, what?
DM: I said, roll for initiative. They like their cheese really ripe in these parts. They have the ooze type.
"Excuse me, but... is it a GOOD or a BAD thing when the DM can't help bursting into laughter every time he hears the phrase 'level-appropriate encounter'? No, just curious..."
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2022-09-26, 06:00 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2007
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- Terra Australis
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Yeah it's pretty much copied from the Vampire template (although in this case, Dodge does have a req):
Vampires gain Alertness, Combat Reflexes, Dodge, Improved Initiative, and Lightning Reflexes, assuming the base creature meets the prerequisites and doesn’t already have these feats.Last edited by Thurbane; 2022-09-26 at 06:01 PM.
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2022-10-05, 05:38 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2014
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- Arcadia
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Decipher Script checks are made secretly:
Both the Decipher Script check and (if necessary) the Wisdom check are made secretly, so that you can’t tell whether the conclusion you draw is true or false.
The Forgery check is made secretly, so that you’re not sure how good your forgery is.Creator of the LA-assignment thread.
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2022-10-20, 07:04 PM (ISO 8601)
- Join Date
- May 2013
Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Arcane Spell Failure only applies to spells with Somatic components, and is the only constraint affected by Armored Mage. Heavy shields prevent you from using that hand for material or somatic components independently of ASF. Arcane Channeling requires a weapon to deliver the attack. Consequently, the only conditions where the Duskblade's 7th-level improvement of Armored Mage applies to their Arcane Channeling is if they are doing it with a Shield Bash, an Unarmed Strike, a book-dived probably-Exotic hands-free weapon, or have more than two arms.
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2022-10-20, 08:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2016
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- Italy
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Forgive me if any of these had already be mentioned, but I'm very fond of positive/negative energy nonsense, such as:
- Undead technically - RAW - not taking damage on the Positive Energy plane (it gives fast healing, and undead can have fast healing too), although anyone in their right mind would know it's implicit that it's positive-energy-based fast healing, and that it should deal harm to undead.
- Undead technically not gaining any healing by the fact of being on the negative energy plane (negative energy plane imposed negative levels, to which they're immune, but they gain nothing from it; also, a minor negative energy trait will damage living creatures' HPs, but it says nothing about healing undead)
And, loosely related:
Vivacious Creature template, stating that the vivacious creature is incorporeal thus it has no Str score, while at the same time stating that if the creature wants to suppress its Positive Energy Aura, the creature will take 1 point of Str damage for each full minute that the aura is inactive.Last edited by Nikker; 2022-10-20 at 08:11 PM.
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2022-10-21, 12:22 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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- In a castle under the sea
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
The lycanthrope template does not add any of the base animal's subtypes to the base creature, and no mention is made of those subtypes applying in hybrid or animal form. 90% of animals don't have subtypes, and templates which add subtypes would generally change the animal's type to something other than animal, so this usually doesn't matter.
The (aquatic) subtype designates creatures that can breathe water, but not air, such as fish and cephalopods. This ability is tied to the subtype, rather than a special quality or something; if a creature somehow lost its (aquatic) subtype, it would no longer be able to breathe water.
Weresharks drown.
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2022-10-21, 02:39 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2014
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Creator of the LA-assignment thread.
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2022-10-21, 03:11 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2020
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Last edited by loky1109; 2022-10-21 at 03:12 AM.
If you could make anything and everything welcome to the Zinc Saucier XLV: Figaro
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2022-10-21, 03:13 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2014
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- Arcadia
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Creator of the LA-assignment thread.
Join the new Junkyard Wars round and build with Cloaked Dancer and a companion creature!
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2022-10-21, 03:18 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2020
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
If you could make anything and everything welcome to the Zinc Saucier XLV: Figaro
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Spoiler: For purposes of clarity1109 is September, 11 - my birthday.
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2022-10-21, 08:14 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
I expect weresharks would bite anyone who wound up in the water. And while aquatic elves are always in the water, there are a lot more air-breathers, and some of them are sailors.
I wouldn't expect there to be a ton of air-breathing weresharks, but I also wouldn't expect there to be a ton of weresharks period.
On one hand, the designers definitely intended there to be some easy way to the top. On the other hand, siege towers like this still have some use; you can climb up out of enemy arrow-range. Sure, you can only get a few people onto the tower, but historically siege towers were used to get high ground for archers more often than they were used for escalade.
It's not not dysfunctional, but it's less dysfunctional than it seems! (And it's a decent excuse to point out fun historical trivia.)
Let's check the source!
Originally Posted by Stormwrack
What's not arguable, however, is that this spell was intended to conjure half a trillion gallons of water. That kind of apocalyptic effect is reserved for 9th-level spells, and if a spell is intended to drown air-breathing casters, it would mention something about that. It's obviously intended to turn existing water into blackwater, so an interpretation that turns it into a mass-water-conjuration effect is dysfunctional.
They're useful if you want to make a were-elephant or something. Or you could ignore that rule about the base creature and base animal needing to be almost the same size.
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2022-10-21, 09:28 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2020
Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
In actual fact, the base animal must be a predator, scavenger or omnivore and although the former are infamous for their ability to eat anything, technically speaking, neither goats, nor elephants qualify on account of being herbivores. Huge(+) animals that are eligible include big snakes, some dinosaurs, orcas, cachalot whales, giant crocodiles and the like.
Last edited by Metastachydium; 2022-10-21 at 09:31 AM.
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2022-10-21, 10:16 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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- In a castle under the sea
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
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2022-10-21, 02:55 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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- Tula, Russia
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2022-10-23, 10:00 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Nov 2019
Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
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2022-10-31, 06:01 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2010
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
I certainly mentioned this already, but I'm not sure it was in such a thread... anyway:
The Cerebral Hood symbiont from the Fiend Folio covers the face of its host facehugger-style and insert its tail inside the throat. Among other benefit, this symbiont makes the host immune to gas, including inhaled poison and disease, since it is basically breathing in his stead...
Just a little problem with that: the Cerebral Hood is an aberration, thus a living being, and nowhere it is stated to be immune to gas or poisons itself. Hence, if you're trying to use it to protect yourself from a toxic environment, the rather weak symbiont is going to die sooner or later, leaving then the host to fend for himself.Spoiler
DM: At the end of the meal, the innkeeper is bringing you the cheese plate. Roll for initiative.
PC: Excuse me, what?
DM: I said, roll for initiative. They like their cheese really ripe in these parts. They have the ooze type.
"Excuse me, but... is it a GOOD or a BAD thing when the DM can't help bursting into laughter every time he hears the phrase 'level-appropriate encounter'? No, just curious..."
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2022-11-01, 10:46 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Feb 2011
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- Texas
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
If you had a mind for a nontraditional lycanthrope, the division between herbivores and carnivores is not as binary as most laypeople think. Goats, elephants, deer, cows, etc can and do eat anything that's small, weak, and slow enough for them to catch on occasion.
Last edited by Venger; 2022-11-01 at 10:46 PM.
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2022-11-02, 10:35 AM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
On one hand, yes, basically every "herbivore" is technically an omnivore. On the other hand, the fact that the rulebook distinguishes "predator, scavenger, or omnivore" as separate categories from "animal" indicates that it's using a broader, more colloquial definition of "omnivore," one that covers boars and bears but not every grazing animal on the planet.
Just be honest and say you're breaking the dumb rule.
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2022-11-02, 11:55 AM (ISO 8601)
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- Mar 2020
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- Moscow
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
I think it's some sort of natural selection. To spread out lycanthrope should be able to reproduce itself. They reproduce via infection through saliva-blood way. Base animal should be able to do so behaviorally. For example horses bite humans often, elephants... I don't think so.
Last edited by loky1109; 2022-11-02 at 11:55 AM.
If you could make anything and everything welcome to the Zinc Saucier XLV: Figaro
My competition's medals.
Spoiler: For purposes of clarity1109 is September, 11 - my birthday.
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2022-11-02, 01:23 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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- In a castle under the sea
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
1.) Plenty of herbivorous animals bite, and plenty of scavengers only bite dead animals. (Undead werevultures arising from corpses bitten by werevultures would be cool, but that's not how the rules work.)
2.) If that was the idea, wouldn't it make sense to restrict the base animal to creatures with bite attacks, rather than by diet? Not perfect, but it's a closer approximation. I'm pretty sure it's just a genre thing; werewolves and wererats are scary/creepy in a way wererabbits and werecows aren't.
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2022-11-10, 04:29 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
Harper Paragon PrC (Player's Guide to Faerûn) got Aura of Good class feature:
The power of the character’s aura of good is equal to her Harper paragon level. If she has the aura of good ability from another class, levels of that class stack with her Harper paragon levels for the purpose of this ability.
Originally Posted by Player's Guide to Faerûn
Originally Posted by Book of Exalted Deeds
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2022-11-10, 04:49 PM (ISO 8601)
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- May 2009
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
By RAW, that just makes a Harper Paragon with non-paladin/cleric/HarPar levels slightly harder to detect with detect good. It's dysfunctional, but it's not as consequential a dysfunction as you're describing.
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2022-11-10, 05:25 PM (ISO 8601)
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- Jul 2011
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Re: Dysfunctional Rules X: I Cast Comprehend Rules
So, you think it actively reducing the strength of existing Aura of Good?
Are you sure?
I mean - if it's from the feats rather than class features...
Noticed: Aura of Good as class feature required for Triadic Knight PrC.
I thought it could be a niche use for HarPar's Aura of Good - but then noticed it also required Initiate of Ilmater, Torm, or Tyr - all of which are available only to clerics or paladins...
Is Aura of Good CF a redundant prerequisite there?