Multiclassing Caster

[Myzz]

So my initial understanding of Multiclassing Full casters was - Boooo... The only reason to multiclass is to double your low level spell slots...

As I read - YAAAAY... I get 9th level slots as a Wiz/Sorc wooot!

then I visited these forums and no one was talking about how awesome a 10 Wiz / 10 Sorc would be... So I read very carefully through the multiclassing section:

"...If you have more than one spellcasting class, this table might give you spell slots of a level that is higher than the spells you know or can prepare. You can use those slots, but only to cast you lower level spells..."

Oh crap... does a Wizard have restrictions on what spells they can prepare based on wizard level???

so I flip back to wizard and read through the spell prep section:

"...the spells must be of a level you have spell slots."

Does that mean there is no real level restriction for what spells a wizard can prepare?

I looked through each class and they seem to have the same verbage as the wizard. So I'm currently assuming that some mistake was made somewhere in editing. Either:

1. The section on multiclassing means that all caster are capped by caster level, but can access higher spell slots by pushing lower level spells. And ALL classes forgot to add that descriptor... or the wording on the multiclass descriptor should not say might and should instead say will.

or

2. The restrictions were intentionally removed from each class section, and the statement that there might be a restriction was not removed.

And yes, I understand that spell slots are added ONLY ever other level even to full casters... AND that by gaining a single solitary level you would not have access to new spell slots... but a multiclass character will eventually have access to spell slots that a single class of his would not normally on its own have....

AM I wrong in assuming this?

[Callin]

In the multiclass section it says you figure out spells prepared as if you were single classed. So if you are a Wiz 3 you can only prepare 2nd lvl wizard spells... even if you ha e 9th level slots. Now those spells can be cast out of those higher level slots though.

[Joe the Rat]

Multiclassing rules are an option, so it is not explained under the classes. But you've got it on 1. Wizard10 /Sorc10 can only prepare/learn spells available to a Wizard 10 and Sorc 10, but you have a full 20 caster levels of slots, so you can cast from those higher slots - in many cases to greater effect.

The might give you higher level slots is contingent on having enough combined class levels. Wiz 3 / Cleric 1 (total caster level: 4) doesn't get 3rd level spell slots, but Wiz 3 / Cleric 2 (total 5) would.

[Shadow]

The "might" part is in the case of fractional casters (ranger/paladin/EK/AT) and warlocks.
You prepare and learn spells as if you were single classed. You have slots equal to that which a single classed character would have at your 'caster level' (even though CL isn't a thing).
So a Wizard 7 (CL 7, 4th level spells prepared) / Arcane Trickster 6 (CL 2, 1st level spells known) does, for example, would know the spells and cantrips that a 6th level Arcane Trickster, and can prepare spells as a 7th level Wizard. He has the spell slots available that a 9th level caster (7wiz + 2at = 9, 5th level slots), and can use the higher level slots to upgrade his lower level spells.
Or a Wizard 18 / Ranger 2, for example, prepares spells as an 18th level Wizard and knows a couple 1st level Ranger spells. He only knows a couple of 1st level Ranger spells, but can cast them in a 9th level slot if he wants (big healing available on a wizard).

[Myzz]

Yeah I was affraid thats what it meant...

That IMO makes multiclassing as any full caster nearly pointless, especially beyond 2 level dip.
Don't get access to more low level spell slots
Don't get access to high level spells

I can see the reasoning, otherwise technically you could Sorc 19 / Wiz 1 for access to all wiz spells and then cast all wiz spells independent of wiz level with full sorc ability to metamagic them... granted you couldn't prep many...

Does anyone see any balance issues with removing this restriction as a homerule and making pure caster classes multiclass as the olden days where they had to keep them in balance level wise? or only allowing level ups at every even level if you have 2 full caster classes and then both level?

so would a 10 Sorc / 10 Wiz with access to cast his 9th level spells be that OP and unbalancing?

[Demonic Spoon]

so would a 10 Sorc / 10 Wiz with access to cast his 9th level spells be that OP and unbalancing?

Of course it would be unbalancing. You're asking for the class features of two separate classes without a tradeoff for any of them.


I'm not actually sure a 10 sorc/10 wiz would be that bad. Metamagic is pretty damn good, and the full wizard spell list is pretty good, and the top level spell slots are very limited anyway. Also, because spells scale based on slot and not on caster level (caster level not being a thing in 5e), you can still cast, say, your 5th level spell in a 9th level slot for some improved power, even if it isn't quite as good as a 9th level spell.

[Myzz]

Of course it would be unbalancing. You're asking for the class features of two separate classes without a tradeoff for any of them.

your giving up 10 levels in each of them as a trade off, with the sorc thats 10 spell points and giving up those class features as well to retain status as a 20th level caster in regards to casting level 9 spells...

in previous editions you traded off the ability to cast your higher level spells to gain double the lower level ones... that mechanic does not quite work, with exception to taking warlock...

for this combo I am actually looking to use it lure one of my players back to D&D after he resigned due to 4e. He is set against D&D atm, mostly because he loves Hero. I really like 5e and would like to continue running games in my homebrew world...